A Note on Triggers in Group Support
Hello Lovely People of 7 Cups,
I hope you're all having a wonderful day! I'm posting today as I've noticed a few issues with triggers in the group support rooms lately, particularly on the teen side.
Being triggered is an awful feeling and it's not something we want you to experience in our support rooms, or at all in your lives! The tricky thing about triggers is that something could trigger one person badly, yet not bother another person in the slightest. Its not always possible to predict this. Additionally, it can be frustrating for members if they are prevented from discussing an issue theyre comfortable with, for the sake of a person who may or may not be triggered and who may or may not be there.
When group support was very shiny and new, we did try to moderate triggers. What happened? It became almost impossible to have any conversation at all. So many people were triggered by so many different things, the flow of discussion was interrupted and many people were unable to talk about what was on their minds. It just didn't work for the whole room to avoid a topic for the sake of one person. For this reason, we introduced the following rule:
Rule #4 - If you are overwhelmed, anxious, or do not feel that the group support environment is aiding in your personal healing, please visit our Browse Listeners page to connect with a Listener one-on-one.
Additionally, we have a rule in place to prevent people from using inappropriate or graphic language, so you can expect topics or language that is upsetting for lots of people to be removed and a warning sent to that person. But for the most part, triggers come down to personal responsibility and you are expected to manage your own experience in the support rooms.
☆ If you find you are easily triggered by many things, group support may not be a good fit for you. In that case, we'd recommend you stick to 1-1 chat, the forum or growth path for support.
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Here's what you can do if you're feeling triggered by something in a chat room:
♥ Mute the person who is triggering you.
♥ Take a short break from the room and try out a mindfulness exercise.
♥ Take a short break from the room and do something you love - go for a walk, listen to music, phone a friend, take a bath etc.
♥ Connect 1-1 with a listener to talk through your feelings.
@Heather I appreciate this, but I do disagree with it. While it's true that people may have a lot of different triggers, and I understand it's hard to moderate, I feel like there should be SOME responsibility placed on the person causing the trigger or maybe some kind of awareness of common triggers or people should use trigger warnings. Even though it may not have been on purpose, they should try to apologize or change their behavior. I do appreciate the muting option, but I don't like "it's the triggered person's responsibility", because that feels a little victim-blamey and dismissive. When I read that, I felt angry, because it feels like a silencing of the person who is being triggered or a minimizing of the trigger as "not a big deal". I also feel that it implies that the person causing the trigger was completely innocent and has no responsibility. Maybe if there was a better way to submit feedback/complaints about group chat, I might feel more heard. For me, some triggers that I experience reflect a general lack of awareness about an issue. I prefer to feel empowered to speak up and create change about it. When I read this message, I felt angry also, because I felt there was a tone of getting people with triggers to be quiet or behave, instead of centering empowerment and allowing people to make their voices heard in ways that could actually change the culture.
@Daydreamer47 i agree totally with your post.... Amen, finally someone stands up for the suffering...
@Daydreamer47
I really agree with this. Thanks so much for speaking up! I think you conveyed your point in a really nice, polite way, and I think you made some awesome points. Adding on to what you said, I don't think this should be a warning really... if someone is triggered, they should be given the suggestion to leave, but a warning is very... victim-blaming I think? If someone is triggered, they shouldn't get in trouble for it, and receiving a warning might upset them even more.
I don't mean to be rude to anyone and I really appreciate what you're doing, I'm merely suggesting another way to go about the issue that might be better for the community as a whole.
@Daydreamer47 So you are feeling like the person triggered is being held responsible and the triggerer is not being held acountable. I believe what @Heather is saying is that no one should hold the blame if the trigger was accidental or coincidence. Conversations that are happy and cheerful to some are painful and triggering for others. I am reasonably certain every happy topic somebody can come up with will trigger somebody. Shall we stop all conversation?
You could talk about your awersome mother, adorable children, pet furr babies, good relationships, wonderful mariages, and while these all make you invision rainbow butterfly unicorn kittens, these would bring me painful memories of which at times would trigger me.
Now if someone comes along and starts with the gory details of something horrible, that is a different story. We all have a mut option. I have muted various people for reasons many people would not. I have not muted some who many would have.
I hope this makes some sense. I think somebody else could explain my thoughts better than I can. In the mean time...
@energeticCircle9867 Thanks for your comment, but I feel like you missed my point, and I feel patronized and angry. I understood what she was saying. When you said "let me explain what she was saying", I felt very angry and frustrated, because I feel that this statement is talking down to me and treating me like a child. Also my thoughts and feelings are valid. In the future, please take a step back and listen to other perspectives instead of just defending your own, and please take suggestions for improvement seriously by saying something like "That is a good suggestion. Let's work on implementing it. Your voice matters." I thought this was a place where we could make suggestions for changes. My voice and opinions do matter, so please do not silence me. Unless admins think they are Gods maybe and are above the rest of us.... :( :(
You are making an assumption that people know what a "gory graphic scene" is, but I think there's a false assumption there. For example, I have an anxiety disorder, and there are common phrases that trigger people with anxiety such as "don't worry about it! Calm down!" There are also common sexist or racist stereotypes that people have as unconscious bias but may not consider overt hate speech. I believe people are capable of becoming educated and improving their awareness. I thought it was clear from what I already said, but I was not referring to someone talking about something innocent and happy. When you said that, I felt incredibly dismissed, belittled, and angry. I was talking about members taking responsibility for improving their behavior and being considerate of others, which should be a perfectly reasonable request for adults. For example, if you are going to talk about a friend being raped, you should mention a trigger warning in the chat in case there is another person there who is a survivor. That is 100% a reasonable request. I will not be silenced.
@Daydreamer47
I agree that it would be nice if people would monitor their behaviour a bit more and be held responsible for their actions. HOWEVER, this isn't always fesible. Here is an example of what I personally have experienced here that might help to clarify why agree with this post.
1) I was in a chat room and we were talking about funny driving stories. Someone drove up the exit lane onto a highway. We were all laughing at the horror we would feel if we experienced this. One person in the chat room said they had gotten in a car accident a year ago and were too afraid to get in a car now so can we please stop talking about it?
In this situation, what do you think is fair?
Do you believe that a chatroom full of 20 or so people should have to stop their conversation and switch to a new topic because this person is triggered? No gory details were shared, no horrifying scene was given, just stories we've encountered, mostly light hearted.
If we humour that ONE PERSON who is triggered by cars and switch to another topic, what topic is safe? What if we start talking about what we'll be doing for father's day and someone in the room has a bad relationship with their father? Can we not discuss that as well?
There is a fine line between appropriate and not appropriate and deciding what is and what isn't appropriate is hard. Deciding what's best for the community while considering the needs of the many is hard.
In my car situation; we have a few options. We can all change topics, We can continue to talk about what we're talking about and cause this person to get worked up, or that one person who is struggling can leave and talk to a listener in 1:1 about what they're feeling while everyone else continues their conversation. Which sounds best to you?
Does this help? I hope i'm not coming off condescending because I see your point. It seems fairly easy to ask everyone to be nice to each other. Unfortunately, it's almost never that cut and dry.
@Yougotthisdontfret I'm sorry, but yes again it did come off as condescending because you seem to not really be reading what I said, and AGAIN seem to not be open to suggestions for improvement. I am going to stand by my position. Please STOP trying to convince me. The fact that you talked about a father's day example makes me feel like you missed my point, and I feel angry and frustrated.
For the fourth time (I am very angry and frustrated that people still are not listening and actually considering what I have to say), I was requesting that members be educated about COMMON triggers that have a theme where there is a lack of education about a common trigger. The example of father's day was not what I was talking about. I was talking about COMMON triggers that represent a lack of education in society about certain issues. This might mean updating the guidelines or requiring members to take some training quiz before they enter the chat or something. For example, it is required by law to have sexual harassment training at work because sexual harassment is a trigger. No one tells the victim of harassment that it is their job to remove themselves from their harasser. Responsibility for sexual harassment falls on the perpetrator, and that is why there is a required prevention training.
I do not need to have Heather's post explained to me. I want YOU to actually consider what I said and be open to it, which you did not do at all. My voice matters. I will not be silenced. My post was not really an invitation for counterarguments. It was an opportunity for people to STOP and LISTEN. In the future, please hold back from commenting until you have considered my points and say something like "that is a good idea."
Please do not post further condescending counterarguments on my post. Post them elsewhere if you feel the need to express yourself. Don't make my post about you.
@Daydreamer47
For the fourth time (I am very angry and frustrated that people still are not listening and actually considering what I have to say), I was requesting that members be educated about COMMON triggers that have a theme where there is a lack of education about a common trigger. The example of father's day was not what I was talking about. I was talking about COMMON triggers that represent a lack of education in society about certain issues. For example, it is required by law to have sexual harassment training at work because sexual harassment is a trigger. No one tells the victim of harassment that it is their job to remove themselves from their harasser. Responsibility for sexual harassment falls on the perpetrator, and that is why there is a required prevention training. It seems you might be a little confused about what a trigger is. A trigger is when you hear of something that triggers a bad feeling or bad memory. Sexual harrassment is not a trigger. Sexual harrassment is a crime. It is THE bad memory. There is a WORLD of difference between sexually harrassing someone and saying something that will spark a bad feeling. No one would ever tell the victim of sexual harrassment to take responsibility because they are not responsible for another person's actions. If John is walking down the isle of Target and his co worker walks by and grabs his butt that is A WORLD OF DIFFERENCE from if Mary says to John "we should go to Target" and it sparks a memory of being grabbed there. In this case sexual harrassment is the CAUSE. Target/sexual harrassment is the trigger. We cannot educate about common triggers because there is no common trigger. Everyone's triggers are different.
I do not need to have Heather's post explained to me. I want YOU to actually consider what I said and be open to it, which you did not do at all. My voice matters. I will not be silenced. My post was not really an invitation for counterarguments. It was an opportunity for people to STOP and LISTEN. In the future, please hold back from commenting until you have considered my points and say something like "that is a good idea." I have considered what you said. However, I will not let you silence me either. If I listen to your argument and I don't agree with it, I will not be told I cannot voice my opinion on it simply because you said I'm not allowed to. I have heard your argument. You want blame to lie with the person causing the bad feelings. This works for actions such as sexual harrassment. It doesn't work for things like triggers because there are no common or universal triggers. Unfortunately, if we censor everyone in order to make sure no one is ever triggered or offended, no one would ever be able to speak.
Please do not post further condescending counterarguments on my post. Post them elsewhere if you feel the need to express yourself. Don't make my post about you. Once again, I understand why you might not want to hear counterarguments, however, that is the point of this thread. We are discussing taking personal responsibilty for your triggers and emotions. We are not discussing taking personal responsibilty for other people's actions or words, but rather just for ourselves and how we react. I hope that this post helps to explain why you are receiving the counterarguments and what we are trying to convey to you. :)
@Yougotthisdontfret
Well done. Thank you.
@Yougotthisdontfret I think it's reasonable to ask that others express their opinions in a way that is not invalidating my own experience or feelings, or at least shows kindness and empathy towards my experience and feelings.
You should be able to express your own opinion and experience and feelings without needing to be right I guess. If you had just said, "My feelings on the issue are X", I would be fine. What upset me is feeling like people jumped on my post to talk down to me like a child and invalidate my feelings. You should be able to feel valid about your own experience without needing to invalidate mine. Yes, we are here to discuss solutions, but this is also supposed to be a supportive mental health community where we should be kind towards others who are hurting.
@Daydreamer47 - When you talk about "common triggers", are you refering more to being courteous and politically correct? So for example, not calling a group of mixed gender people "guys", or not saying, "just calm down!" to someone with anxiety?
If that's the case, I wouldn't say you need to leave the room over it (unless you were feeling angry and upset to the point you could no longer engage reasonably!). It would be absolutely okay to calmly and politely mention something, like: "As a female I dislike being referred to as one of the guys."
You've also mentioned sexual harassment... if someone was sexually harassing you in the room that would fall under other categories. for example rule #2 (no flirting or abusive/inappropriate language), so it still wouldn't be okay. In that case you should definitely mute/report the person.
Does this info help?
@Daydreamer47 I am sorry you feel this way, it wasn't my intention. I knew I could word things better than I had but I had been awake for two days and my brain was just fried. I suffer with depression, anxiety, panic attacks, disabilities and all sorts of issues. I will think about all you have said and think about how I express myself and look for any of the things you spoke of to own what is mine.
@Daydreamer47 - If a member talks about something using graphic or inappropriate language, they'd be violating rule #2. If they are being unsupportive, they'd be violating rule #1. I'm certainly not saying people should be able to get away with anything in the chat rooms, especially not if it's intentionally hurtful.
What is it about the culture that you're wanting to change?
@Heather Thanks for responding Heather. I think I need to take a break from this thread. Could I maybe inbox or email you another time in maybe a week or so? Thanks for taking the time to read my comments.
So I ask myself,am I triggered in chat? No. Am I frustrated when someone tells the same false extremely graphic tale almost daily for over a year? Yes.
@mutter3 Given that this is an online support site, how in the world would you have any idea if someone's story is "false?" That sounds quite judgmental and easily furthers abuse victims' reluctance to speak up for fear of not being believed.
@proactiveTiger3409 Judgement is defined as the ability to come to sensible conclusions. I came to a sensible conclusion. How would you know if someone on this site is telling the truth? It is wrong to try to shame me for expressing my thoughts by saying I am perpetuating abuse victims reluctance to speak out. I never said a word about abuse victims.
@mutter3 There is a huge difference between judgement and being judgemental. Judgement could be viewed as having good common sense. The following I found at https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/theory-knowledge/201305/making-judgments-and-being-judgmental
"someone is being judgmental when their judgments are power-driven, unempathetic, based on their own idiosyncratic values or tastes, overly based on other peoples character, and are closed, shallow, and pessimistic, and ultimately have the consequence of making the other person feel problematically diminished."
@proactiveTiger3409 I hope you always have a safe unjudgemental place here.
@energeticCircle9867 Thank you for the definition of judgemental. Based upon your definition it is clear I was exercising good judgement rather than being judgemental.
@mutter3 why does that affect you? how many times has anyone mentioned gther mute button? im sorry but your post makes zero sense if only to stir the pot...
@AtoningBlueberries8832 What is gther????? I'm sorry but I really don't understand your post. Perhaps you could rephrase it. Thank you.
@atoningblueberries8832 sorry don't know how your name got on my post.
@exuberantRaspberries0034. What is gther?? I'm sorry but I do not understand your post. Perhaps try rephrasing it. Thank you.
@Heather, beautiful post. I have a question, I see people get told and sometimes yelled at for talking about self harm and abuse and bullying in the chat rooms. Is that a real rule? I've looked in the chat room rules and I don't see anything and states that but I just want to know if I'm missing something. Thank you for your time.
@CeciliaTheDragon - Nope, the only rules are the ones stated in the pop up when you click the blue "chatroom rules" link at the bottom of the chat screen. :)
The closest thing we do have is this rule: "Please do not use language that is graphic, inappropriate, flirtatious or sexually suggestive. Additionally, refrain from sharing links of this nature."
So, if someone was describing a self harm injury or method in a particularly graphic way it could fall under this rule. However, sharing that you're struggling with self-harm would not be a problem in itself.
These seem like good options but also seem unfair on the person in distress, or trying to have a legitimate conversation. If there is someone causing an issue and triggering people while someone else is there in the support group seeking support it seems unfair to ask the person in need of support to leave. That person may have already tried 1-1 and mindfulness and have come to the group because they are still struggling only to be met with someone causing an issue. Often when this happens and you ask the person causing the issue to stop they don't and you just get a whole heap of comments about being too sensitive and stuff when there is usually a legitimate reason for asking for things to be different. Also, even if the person in distress takes a short break and then returns, often the cause of the problem is still there in the chat leaving the person in need of support feeling like they can't go back in to the chat and like they then have nowhere to go to get some help. The whole point of the group support chats are to support people so feel that perhaps ways in which the problem can be addressed more thoroughly to not exclude or push those in need away would be more beneficial.
@ShatteredMentality - When you describe a person who is triggering, what exactly do you mean? Is it triggering that is the problem here, or generally inappropriate/unkind behaviour? If it's the latter, then they would be breaking rule #1.
@Heather it can be both, sometimes someone continues on a topic when it has been said it is causing triggering and sometimes that is intentional and other times it happens cause too many keep it going or it is dismissed as being triggering or the person triggered is made to feel like they are being unreasonable and should leave. Another problem with common triggering topics (eg abuse) is people who regularly come and continue to talk about it even after being told this is a triggering topic in group chats.
There are also instances when someone comes in being unkind and unsupportive which yes is a trigger and yes breaks the rule but even if a mod does turn up it usually takes quite a bit before that person is dealt with or muted which can in turn add to how much someone is upset of further triggered by that behaviour as it seems like nothing is being done.
@ShatteredMentality - In these cases, do you think the person feeling triggered uses the personal mute button? That could really help here.
@Heather the magical mute button doesn't solve everything though, for example...there was a regular in one of the group chats who revealed yesterday that the picture and persona they had been getting to know everyone as was fabricated, like they used some random woman's picture and pretended to be her when they are really a guy. This was being discussed in the group and the more it was being discussed the more it became triggering because of the deception and stuff and people's reactions or lack of reaction to it. Muting the source of the trigger would not have solved this problem, and that can quite often be the cause. Even if you muted the source of the problem it can still be part of the conversation if the source is still there talking with others.
@ShatteredMentality - For sure! Personal mutes work best for situations where it's one person bothering you. If the situation involves the whole room and they're discussing it, a personal mute isn't really going to help. In that case, you should use the emergency form to call a moderator in to help.
Is the user you mentioned still active? If so, please could you PM me their account name so I can look into it? Thank you!
Completely agree! Thank you @easyCucumber9508 for sharing this :)
@Heather
It's a valid point but a lot of members and listeners are feeling quite taken aback by this, which is also perfectly understandable. Personally I have no problem with stepping out of the room when feeling triggered, however a lot of these members and listeners use this room as a way to relax, get support or keep in contact with their 7 cups friends. I have in the past been very irritated by the constant need to change subjects or adjust to triggers but I've grown a little more resitant and patient. Many have felt that this was a way to blame the victim (The person being triggered) and I understand that demonising or criminalising the user was not the intent of this post at all. I think it's just important that we talk things out and support the user who is struggling rather than guilting them out of the room. I fear that inexperienced or newer moderators would use this to support unnecessary warnings. Surely we have the ability to make slight adjustments for our friends. I'm not too sure about the other rooms but I know for a fact that the Teen Community Room has been very understanding of one another's triggers, and consistently refrain from crossing boundaries or disrespecting one another. We have been able to work in harmony despite having to slightly adapt to those around us, and I believe that these sorts of adjustments should also be encouraged. I mean no disrespect, but I believe that if people are happy to make and continue making such adjustments (as they have always done), there should be no need to ask a triggered person to leave. Being triggered truly is an awful experience, but sometimes a positive environment and being surrounded by friends is just what they need to get things settled.
We all have triggers, but I'm more than happy to support and welcome those who are struggling with such triggers into our community and support rooms. If they are becoming overwhelmed or acting eradically I'd rather ask them to PM me, or provide them with additional resources and the option to take a quick break from the conversation, before making any rash decisions. I think it's important that we encourage flexibility and allow moderators to control the situation that they best see fit. I'm sure we can all work together as a community to create a more positive and loving environment.
Would love to hear your input on the matter: @easyCucumber9508 @EnigmaticPetrichor @arxxxh @CoryIsHere
EMETOPHOBIA!
As an Emetophobia sufferer (vomitphobia) please can you sensor the word "vomit" . "Sick" and "throwing up" are a little easier on the eyes but that word really gives me great anxiety. I've notice a few other people with this problem so please can you do something about it! :D
Good post.
Is this for I been asking to talk to some one they say they don't understand stand me so I'm think I'm not never competing back my person I don't talk to that much told me u guys are here to help but where can I get some one to talk to they say they don't understand me
@cbbubble1300 i could help you if u wanted trust me i feel the same way
@AriannaZepeda hola :)
@ShowerDreamer hola! Como estas?
@cbbubble1300 what's wrong? Let's talk
I always sort of feel bad for getting triggered, especially since mine are a wide variety and some are completely normal words that people use. And almost always people don't even know and they've done nothing wrong. Eh, I just wish I didn't have so many.
@Cyane
I understand, I am dealing with this same issue. And just as you said, some are very common words or phrases that people use all the time.
I told a friend the other day that it seems like I just have too many triggers. And a lot of people don't understand what that means.
For me, when I'm triggered, it doesn't mean that I just "don't like something". It actually throws me right back to the trauma that created that particular trigger.
So not only do I still carry a ton of shame from past traumas, but I am also ashamed of how many triggers I still have today and how easily I can be jerked back to then instead of staying in the now.
I haven't figured out how to not be triggered, but I hope that both of us can find a way.
Thinking of you......
@BJY
Thank you and best wishes, love <3
@BJYThank you for explaining what triggers do for those who are fortunate enough to not have them.
One of my odd ones that I will share is the pattern camouflage. I had someone in my life that always verbally abused me and he sexually abused me and raped me and threatened to kill me when I finally left him. He wore camo all the time. When I see it 6 years later I still flashback and panic about it.
I also feel this way about guns. They scare me also.
These are 2 that I will share at this time.
