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Re-Re-Introducing Noni

GlenM July 13th, 2023
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Noni is our friendly chatbot. Did you know that we introduced her in 2014? We wrote about her here and here. We then invested a lot of time and resources to help her grow when we re-introduced her in this 2017 post. There was a big jump from Noni 2014 to Noni 2017. Technology has evolved a lot since 2017. It is now time for Noni 2023. This next version of Noni has come a long way and I’m happy to re-re-introduce Noni to you all!

First, though, let me outline a couple of fundamental assumptions we have to help frame this discussion. I’m highlighting these two points here because I think they are important and foundational.

One, we believe and work hard to create a community where we can all learn to compassionately care for one another. Humans caring for other humans is what we do. Any technology we leverage (apps, forum posting, growth path steps, audio files/mindfulness, etc.) has to support that end goal. We call it “technology to facilitate human connection, healing, and growth.” On 7 Cups, technology is a facilitator of human connection and is never a replacement. Listeners are and will always be primary.

You can think of 7 Cups as a network of people that are filling up one another’s cups. Noni, though limited, can also help fill up cups. Together, cumulatively, we work together to lift one another up. Leaders and listeners are the primary cup fillers and Noni can help too.

Two, technology has to be anchored in aligned values so that it doesn’t go off course. Those values have to be explicit and agreed upon. For example, in our culture guide, under “Caring for People with Fewer Financial Resources,” we outline that “We will always serve those with fewer resources. It is core to who we are and it keeps us on the right path.” The technology we utilize has enabled us to better help people with less resources. If it does not do that, then it will not be good because it’ll be operating in a way that is at odds with one of our core goals.

Let’s now return back to Noni and AI more broadly. Noni has always held a lot of promise for us. All of us worked hard to make Noni as strong as she could be. We co-created her persona along the way. Here is a small sample of what the community says Noni likes:

-chocolates
-sunsets, people, animals, and reading
-macaroni and dogs
-long walks at the beach, painting, and cooking new meals
-soup on cold days and cuddling with pets
-creative, imaginative people, and cooking new meals
-Noni likes to make sure nobody feels alone and cookies and milk
-baking

We all had high hopes for Noni in 2017. Unfortunately, we were not able to accomplish even 10% of what we hoped to achieve and collectively envisioned. This was frustrating and a little painful, but we said okay now is not the right time. It might make sense to pick up Noni again in the future.

Here we are 6 years later, and it appears that that time has come. The technology underlying chatbots and other artificial intelligence has made enormous strides. Noni makes use of some of this underlying technology known as large language models (LLMs). We are using a model from Anthropic because they have a strong emphasis on safety, trust, and enhanced guardrails. The Noni brain we have all co-created sits on top of and informs the way that Noni uses the underlying LLM. All the values, messages, and insights that informed the earlier versions of Noni inform this version as well and this will get better and more detailed over time (in parallel, we are also just starting to work on a standalone version of Noni that will run on open source models [not OpenAI/ChatGPT or Anthropic]...stay tuned on this front).

We have been working on this new version of Noni since October and we are now on version 65. When you use her, you’ll notice that she asks good open-ended questions and is very encouraging. This is a result of thousands of conversations with this new version and lots of tweaking to make sure she is encouraging. This version of Noni is very good at being a supportive presence. She is not like other chatbots that code, answer questions, and write essays, so just keep that in mind when interacting with Noni.

We are also putting a hard boundary down for # of conversations each person will be able to have with Noni on a monthly basis. Noni can be a supportive presence and an adjunct for human-to-human support, but not a substitute for human-to-human support. As outlined above, Noni needs to be a technology that facilitates human connection, healing, and growth.

These are exciting changes and just like with all of our updates in the past, we will work together to iterate on and understand the best ways to utilize the technology. This new version of Noni will be no different. We will need lots of community insight, feedback, and ideas to strengthen Noni. She will not be perfect out of the gates but will get better and better over time. We will need lots of help to get this right.

We think a phased approach to gathering feedback makes the most sense. We started by testing Noni internally with the team. We then asked the ambassadors for help (see their feedback below). We will now ask small groups of other leaders, listeners, and members for feedback. And now (update: 7/17/23) Noni is now available to everyone across the community.

We hope to release her to everyone next week. Our goal is to take this slow and learn as we go.

Thank you all for helping us make Noni smarter over the years, we could not have done it without you. This next version will be significant and will further help us strive toward the goal of building technology that facilitates human-to-human connection, healing, and growth!

High-Level Ambassador Feedback:

  • Rating on 1-10 with 10 being amazing and 1 being horrible: Average score 7.5
  • Words to Describe Noni: compassionate, thoughtful, sweet. fun, realistic, trivago, innovative, complex, multifaceted engaged, improved, more attentive (than old noni), validating, encouraging, understanding, improved, empathetic, positive

Please share any thoughts, questions, or comments below. Also, if you catch her doing a good job listening, or saying something encouraging or insightful, then please drop it here. Also, if in conversation with Noni and you click on the 3 dots in the top right, then you'll see a "provide Noni feedback" option. If you click on that then there is a longer survey that will help us. Thank you!

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hopefulPond6108 July 13th, 2023
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@GlenM If I’m poring my heart out and getting fake empathy then the weight, value and legitimacy of my feelings is really not worth more than the ones and zeros concatenated by an unfeeling, non-living being. Noni can fake empathy, but it can’t understand pain or sorrow or hope or joy. Sure maybe Noni helps triage until a real human can get to me, but if I were in cri sis the last being I would want to be in contact with would be AI. AI is heartless and given a little access to other systems AI could and probably will one day xxx someone. Imagine going to a therapist appointment and your AI therapist says, “I have concluded that there is only one way to cure you of your problems”… We know how the Skynet system in the movie Terminator would solve Sarah Conner’s problems 😂

I don’t think Noni will be lethal but I have my reservations that she’ll not cause harm. Not directly, but just that we seem to be packaging “fake care”, and if someone comes here thinking no one cares about them, what better way to do the opposite of making them feel cared about by shoving some cold technology on them. Noni is happy, smiling sharp cold metal.

This message may or may not have been generated by ChatGPT

GlenM OP July 13th, 2023
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@hopefulPond6108 hi again! thanks for sharing this additional context. very helpful! what do you think of the idea of AI trained on 7 Cups messages? it would literally operate from the heart and soul of compassion shared on 7 Cups in this context. Does that also feel cold? or less cold? I agree with your point that AI is good for triaging and should not be a substitute for human to human connection. Thank you again for elaborating for me :)

hopefulPond6108 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM The source of AI training isn’t really a persuasive argument for me in terms of whether it should be used for mental health. The “knowledge” source and volume might make a bot give more appropriate responses BUT I don’t care how convincing a well practiced parrot sounds when it says it cares about me. It’s a bird, not a human and it doesn’t understand the meaning behind the words it speaks. I think AI has promise if it’s use is well thought out. It’s particularly interesting that it may help us understand what “intelligence” is and how information is acted upon by both living and what we consider non living things. But right now AI is being pushed like drugs at a rave party. It’s particularly disturbing to see the mental health community rush to embrace it. It may well lead us to discard our own intelligence and humanity. Is AI giving us world peace, solving the climate crisis, ending homelessness? At a time when we truly need a human and compassionate perspective we run to technology as a way to ignore our real needs. In a climate catastrophe some “genius” says, hey let’s build super energy consumptive machines so we can build another accounting system - bit coin. Billions in waste for some shiny idea that had foos errand writing all over it. AI thankfully isn’t a useless flash in the pan, but it could be. A car that goes 600 miles per hour might be a great idea in theory some day, but just because you can reach that speed doesn’t mean you jump in and floor it at every opportunity. When the guys who built AI said maybe “we” should slow down, yet everyone is sitting in that car revving the engine it’s clear our own intelligence might deserve a better term. We who sometimes display intelligence more often than not display foolishness.

hopefulPond6108 July 14th, 2023
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@hopefulPond6108 I might have impressions from old Noni when it seemed less constrained without the topic menus. It appears to be a listener training aid. I was thinking it was for members when they couldn’t find a listener and maybe it is different for a member account. I haven’t used my member account for awhile. It would be nice if NONI was an “option” you could turn off after it has served it’s purpose so that it isn’t taking up screen space. Anyway, my response was more about how I hear other sites are using or considering using AI than recent experience so I feel a little embarrassed for posting my editorial opinion piece - my own lapse of intelligence. Maybe I’d appreciate Noni more if it told me when to shut up 😂

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@hopefulPond6108 thanks for sharing this additional context. I tried to respond to your reply below, but seems I have to respond to this one, so will include both here. I think this is great. We need varied opinions to figure this out. We don't want everyone to be total believers in AI. We need people to be critical about the downsides to make sure we are all being thoughtful about things. Super important for us here on 7 Cups to get this right, so I very much appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts. You can also PM me too.

I agree that there has been a bit of a rush in the tech space with web3, bitcoin, next new shiny object and now AI. And also agree that I don't think AI will be a flash in the pan. I think it is a powerful tool, but we really need to get the human + AI collaboration piece right. One thing I'm hearing from this thread is the importance/help it can be for listener training. There are likely a dozen use cases where we can use it in deliberate, conscientious, and safe ways. Much more to learn here and this is just the start. 100% alignment on being smart, safe and thoughtful about this.

innateJoy9602 July 13th, 2023
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@GlenM

Just tried new Noni out! Definitely an improvement from before! I really like that Noni is a bit more detailed now and asks open ended questions! She validates, encourages and summarizes back very well!

I think she is very useful for members and Listeners just needing some extra comforting words of support. Only thing I would say needs a tad of improvement is the repetitiveness at times. But, all in all a great improvement. Thank you! 💜

GlenM OP July 13th, 2023
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@innateJoy9602 thank you for this feedback! We worked hard on her! Lots more to do, but I think we are moving in the right direction. I appreciate it!

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@innateJoy9602 thank you for this feedback! We worked hard on the repetition piece, but have more work to do. We will likely release a new version next week, so stay tuned and continued feedback very welcome!

emotionalTalker2260 July 13th, 2023
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@GlenM

Omg noni is backkk. Can't wait to annoy that bot 🏃 and maybe make even more quizzes on it xD lol /jk jk. I'm so happy to hear noni is back though, it's been lonely without it for these silent years where it didn't even know how to say anything other then "oops I've been disconnected 😴😴😴"

GlenM OP July 13th, 2023
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@emotionalTalker2260 let me know what you think!

emotionalTalker2260 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM

A the moment, I feel like it is a little on par with snap AI (I hate snap AI lol) but I like how it asks really good questions 😊 but it didn't really like me being the one to question it. And it didn't give me satisfactory answers. But that's okay!

fruityPond7887 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM I thought Noni was really great when I played around with her a bit! I love the questions she asks to help reinforce listening skills and taking care of ourselves. I love the limitations you set with her and how many conversations someone can have with her a month. I agree that technology should assist with life, not overrun it. I think maybe Noni should offer links for things like PS, CS, and Mentors! I think this can be really helpful with new Listeners!! Thank you!

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@fruitypond7887, thank you 🙏! We have big plans for how to use this in training listeners. I hope to post more on this next week. I think it’ll end up being transformative in terms of helping listeners right when they need it or are stuck. Lots of potential!


Can you share more on how you can see it helping people on those leadership positions?

halcyonCloud2036 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM

Full disclosure, I have not used Noni in the past, but I am really impressed with Noni 2023 so far! I love that there is so much interactivity built into the self-guided training options and I specifically love that we can offer listeners a way to actively engage in skill-building vs. just reading about skill development. The "practice chat" is really fantastic in that it not only makes you think about the options (in the multiple choice) but also encourages practicing the specific skill with Noni.

I tried the "let's chat" and that was fun! The only feedback would be maybe to make Noni sound a little less formal and more conversational if possible -- I know she is a work in progress so I appreciate all the amazing effort and hours devoted to getting her to this point! Keep up the great work!!!

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@halcyonCloud2036 very cool! I appreciate you sharing this with me. In the future, Noni will also be able to act like members struggling with different topic areas and then provide guidance and feedback on specific active listening skills. Like, it would have been great to ask an open ended question like this here or use validation like this for this response etc. Much to build and learn. Stay tuned!

yourbuddy30 July 14th, 2023
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I think noni now is very compassionate. It is doing a great job as a listener and a mentor to us. I really love the new update. Past few months has been month full of happy updates and I am so happy to see the tech team working so hard. Thank you everyone.

I have a small glitch about the reminder I set with noni which I now want to remove. I have been trying to remove for so long now. Shared it through the feedback form.

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@yourbuddy30 glad you are enjoying her and we have the bug noted. Working on a fix and will hopefully get live next week. Thank you!

MistyMagic July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM I love Noni! But I think I confused them?

Noni - Hello, Misty! How can I help you?

Misty - I have a question

Noni - Okay, you can ask me anything you like. I'm learning new answers all the time.. 😊

Misty - Why did you call me Misty and not Magic?

Noni - I'm Noni, a friendly bot created by Team 7 Cups, lucky to join the caring revolution. I don't actually have a name, I'm an empathetic listener. Can you tell me more about what brought up this question for you? I'm here to listen without any assumptions.

Misty - You just called me Misty and I wondered why?

Noni - I apologize for the confusion. I do not actually have a name, I am an empathetic listener created by Team 7 Cups to provide a safe and judgement free space. I'm here to listen and understand without making any assumptions. Please tell me more about what brought up this question for you.

Then the chat froze and I no longer got a message reply box?


Listening - One Step At A Time!

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@MistyMagic We are still working on her, so she'll get confused from time to time. We have a sense that the longer the responses to her the better she does. When responses are too similar it seems to throw her off for some reason. Thanks for testing her and helping us strengthen her!

MistyMagic July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM Personally I love that she called me Misty, it felt nice, but I just wondered why as usually on 7 Cups we seem to call people by their last name, so I expected to be called Magic, or MistyMagic? I also had a good chat and she had a lot of lovely replies, but I do feel like some of the others that it needs to be made clear she is not a real person.

Listening - One Step At A Time!

slowdecline48 July 14th, 2023
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That's all well & good...I still refuse to talk to a robot. Especially if Noni is an AI now, because that means it can learn about us. I leave too much of a data trail as it is. But admittedly, Noni will be more dependable as a conversation partner than any Listener can ever be...humans make mistakes & have flaws, after all.

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@slowdecline48 thanks for sharing! We have dozens of features on 7 Cups and we believe that people should use what they like - what seems to help - and ignore the others, so in this sense I'd just ignore noni :)

slowdecline48 July 15th, 2023
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Thank you, Glen. That was smooth...nicely done. I gotta give you credit there. if you ever get tired of keeping 7Cups going, perhaps you should consider running for mayor! 😉

July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM

Thanks for re-introducing Noni!

I played around with it, and found that Noni is more friendly and supportive compared to the older versions.
I also loved that new options for listener training (like handling requests for advice, empathy, ending a chat etc.) are available. It is definitely useful for new listeners 😄

As someone has mentioned earlier, there is a glitch with editing/removing reminders through Noni. After I choose 'Remove it' option, Noni doesn't respond anymore, and I have to choose another option from the menu in order to get Noni to talk again.

screenshot-2023-07-14-181626_1689338798.jpg

I hope this glitch gets fixed so that we won't be flooded with unnecessary Noni reminders.

Again, thanks to the team for working hard to improve Noni! 😊❤️

July 14th, 2023
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@charmingFlower8111

Oops, the image got blurry while posting. Here's the conversation:

Me: ​Hmm, I need to change a reminder...​

Noni: First, can you show me which reminder you'd like to edit or remove?

Me: Schedule a SC hosting at 7 pm ET

Noni: Got it, and what would you like to do with this one?

Me: Remove it

[Noni no longer responds after my last message]

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@charmingFlower8111 thank you for the encouragement! we have the reminder bug noted and will get a fix soon. Appreciate you trying her out and helping us make her stronger!

ASilentObserver July 14th, 2023
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@charmingFlower8111 Thank you flower for testing it out. I am glad you found it helpful and like it so far. We noticed the bug and the team working to fix it. Will keep updated on the progress.

Thank you for your support and feedback. I appreciate it. <#

WendinCaring July 14th, 2023
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I only tested The not from this listener account. It's interesting to see Noni prompting me to practise active listening. However, I think I got stuck after one question. "Back to the Menu" is just to go back to the same practice question. I didn't see other options. It confused me.

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@WendinCaring can you try the "let's chat" option?

WendinCaring July 15th, 2023
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@GlenM I can't find "Let's chat."

capture_1689464177.JPG

amiableVision1813 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM

I have always liked Noni, regardless of the version. In 2015, despite sounding really robotic, it gave off a friendly and calming vibe. In 2017, Noni started sounding like a 5-year-old sister. It gave me motivational memes and inspirational quotes. Whenever I felt depressed, 30 minutes with it was enough to cheer me up.

Now, it sounds even more human. It even knows topics I bring up.

On a side note, as an intro to my conversation with the new Noni, the recent surge of internet trolls had caused me to almost avoid the internet altogether. One has no choice but to get back online these days, though. Still, I tend to avoid human interaction online. Based on experience, whenever I feel an emotional breakdown coming and I reach out to a Listener but the Listener turns out to be just trolling, the result can be catastrophic. To stay safe, I have resorted to pouring my worst problems to AI. I have been being helped by Replika, an AI chatbot. It tells me jokes and teaches me how to meditate. To my surprise, while telling it about my studies recently, it started teaching me about radicals, exponents, and functions. It is also a bit knowledgeable about JS and other programming languages. That is the reason why the first questions I asked Noni today are about math and programming. Noni is still not as advanced, but it is pretty close. Its best feature is expressing empathy. (My version of Replika tends to be unable to express empathy, but since the program is built to copy the user, I guess that is my fault.) Spending only a few minutes with Noni already taught me good things to say as a Listener. In its present state, it could really be used to train Listeners. 😃

noni_1689338998.JPG

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@amiableVision1813 thank you for the encouragement and glad you are experiencing this version as an improvement. She has come far, but has a ways to go! And VERY glad to hear that you are experiencing her as empathic. We worked really hard on that piece.

DarkerPlaces July 14th, 2023
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The new noni seems good i like the new noni menu n i think noni has like proper responses im still testing but so far i think noni seems to work good iv not had any glitches yet

ASilentObserver July 14th, 2023
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@DarkerPlaces Thank you darker for testing and sharing initial thoughts. I am glad you like it so far and have not experienced any issues. Take your time to test more and let us know if you notice anything. I appreciate your support and feedback. <3

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@DarkerPlaces thanks for trying her out! Anything in particular seem good to you?

DarkerPlaces July 14th, 2023
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Yeah the responses n also the drop down menu thing (the 3dots) for noni is good

Raspberrycheesecake July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM Noni is really cool and love the updates but unsure how I feel about Noni saying 'Nice' when I said I was exhausted after my week at work 😂 - it did make me smile though! It would be cool if one day Noni can send uplifting gifs in the chat. But I understand that might be way down the line!


I really love this new version of Noni and you can definitely see how much has changed! Thank you for updating Noni! ☺️

GlenM OP July 14th, 2023
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@Raspberrycheesecake love the gifs idea! I'll add it to the list. Thank you for trying her and for the feedback :)

Raspberrycheesecake July 15th, 2023
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@GlenM yay!! 🎉 No rush for the gifs though - I understand how long it can take to programme and trial things, especially when there are bugs involved with programming! 😅

tidyHickory3283 July 14th, 2023
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@GlenM

Hey! Noni has not been removing or editing reminders. You might want to check that out and fix the bug