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Update!

GlenM November 6th, 2019
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All,

Hope you are well! It has been a while since Ive been able to post with any regularity. Fortunately, I have more time - finally - to engage more on things. I wanted to take a minute to share some updates with you.

Startups are tough. Mental health startups are really tough. The thing that separates us is that we are a community of compassionate people dedicated to helping one another out. We are a small city of people aligned on this purpose. Our shared values make our startup considerably more meaningful and purposeful. Ultimately we are and always will be a place where people like you and I can volunteer to help another person by simply listening. That is something special.

One part of running a startup is paying the bills. When we first launched we had a very small team and we were running out of money. We figured out online therapy and that allowed us to keep the lights on. Universities and other organizations came on and that helped too. When we generate more revenue we are able to hire people to further build up our city (better street lights, teachers, firefighters etc.); when we have less revenue we need to let some of those people go in order to best support the city. These times are particularly challenging. More recently, we had to let some people go and this was very difficult for us and has meant less people to help in the city.

Some of you noticed the group room announcement. That is part of the scaling back. Not ideal I know, but we have limited resources at present so we have to be as smart as possible with what we do have. Everyone on the team is working hard to grow revenue so we can scale back up. We are pretty good at this, but things take time to unfold.

Ordinarily we like to give time for discussion and processing before we make a big change, but sometimes we need to act quickly. Ultimately our rooms require an adjustment to help keep them safe as possible. We understand that change can be incredibly hard when youve grown accustomed to certain features or expectations, especially sudden change. It is always your choice if you decide to stay with us and continue utilize the support our community offers. If you do stay, please remember that staff, ambassadors, and volunteer leaders are all human and all deserve to be treated kindly. Just as the rooms, forums, and messaging on 7 Cups should be used with integrity and for emotional support. This is why we do what we do. If you need emotional support and agree to follow our community guidelines we welcome you with open arms. If you would like a chatroom environment free of rules and moderation there are plenty of websites that offer that ability. We will always be here for you if you decide you prefer inclusive, moderated, and safer rooms that are support focused.

If this is where you want to be and you are open to our attempts to increase safety while also surviving the challenges of a startup, then we have each others backs and will steer into problems together solving them one at a time. It isnt always easy but it is always meaningful work and that is what ultimately matters. Thank you for supporting our community team and rallying. We are all in this together.

Onward!!!

[Jill added link]

(Edited by Forum Mentor @Emily619 to fix a typo)

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jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie @TheMadQueen420

fluffyunicorn84 in this thread https://www.7cups.com/forum/SiteUpdates_100/GlensNookCommunity_547/RoomAnnouncement_211731/

said that the requirements are not 5 chats but 25 chats ( 5 chats - 150 messages with each listener ) x5 and then also having the hearts not one chat each with 5 different listeners so maybe thats why people are not seeing rooms even after talking to 5 listeners

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie

so the obvious problem with all this is of course people are going to assume the most logical sane interpretation of 5 chats with 5 listeners (and even then they didnt explain to people that 30 messages was one chat so people would be confused even if it was the sane interpretation of that ) but we forgot this is 7cups and so its 5 chats with each of the 5 listeners and finally not thats explained in one comment tucked away in a thread for people to find maybe or not find

there really needs to be a thread calling for listeners who are willing to dedicate to members 5 chats /150 messages to each person they talk to and of course keep track of messages sent up to the 150

TheMadQueen420 November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8

Except I've had more than the requried amount for the badge, and that's something I made clear in my responses in the very thread you linked. I was told to view my progress and according to that I've had 34 chats and 23 repeat chats. I don't see how that isn't enough to qualify for this badge.

I'm probably gonna leave this site anyway. I only came for the group chats.

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@TheMadQueen420

you must talk to the listener and between the two of you there must be at least 30 messages or more (not less than 10 from you and not less than 10 from them) and so any listener you talk to has to agree to talk to you for that length of time or just try your luck i guess they expect members to do ??? but like i said you can message me and thats one if you dont have the requirements i hope you dont have to start over with 5 new listeners

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@TheMadQueen420

you can message me for one of your chats and anyone else here who needs a listener chat or hearts requirement can message me đź‘Ť we can talk about anything even vent about rooms closing or anything else if you want to

Moonlitrose1 November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8

I'm still confused.. so is it that you have to have 25 chats in general with 150 messages each? Or is it 5 chats with 5 different listeners?

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@Moonlitrose1

you have to talk to 5 listeners and with each listener you talk to between the two of you there has to be sent 150 messages (equal to 5 chats) 5 chats with each of the 5 listeners

RarelyCharlie November 8th, 2019
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@Moonlitrose1 The latest theory seems to be 5 listeners, and 150 messages with each of the listeners (with the 150 messages roughly balanced between you and the listeners). 150 messages is 5 standard "chats" from the system's point of view, but not from a human point of view.

At one message a minute that's about 12

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie

i dont know if it needs to be balanced fluffy said at least 2 messages sent from the listener which doesnt sound balanced at all if its 150 messages (unless thats wrong) really admins need to make a statement explaining all this in detail so everyones on the same page and not saying and thinking different things and everyone wondering why they cant get into chatrooms

RarelyCharlie November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8 My vague memory of it was 10 member messages out of every 30, but I don't know where I read that.

Charlie

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie

thanks charlie will write that down - so actually 30 messages might not equal a chat if it doesnt include 10 messages from the member what i need to be counting is at least 50 messages sent from the member and at least 150 total well hopefully admin makes a post asking for listeners who have the time and are willing to manually count and keep track of all this it doesnt sound like its was too thought out i will do that but not just every listener will so unless theres some sort of organized collection of listeners who will members are going to be wasting a huge amount of time

RarelyCharlie November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8 Ah, well, I'm not sure it's a simple as that Grimacing I think it's more likely that each run of 30 messages must contain at least 10 from the member. The system probably processes this each time a message is sent, looking back over just the last 30 messages and ignoring earlier ones.

Charlie

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie

behold this is what happens when everything is too complicated things dont add up and people get confused and its distraction feeding into distraction if its not simplified and organized but we are just howling at the moon it seems *sigh* oh well we can only try ;)

fluffyUnicorns84 November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8 It seems my understanding was wrong, so we just trying to figure out exactly what it is.

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@fluffyUnicorns84

oh thats ok heart i just want to make sure everyones on the same page whatever the page is whether its 30 or 150 lol and its seems to be page 30 which is good but even finding a listener willing to have a 30 or more message chat and sending and getting at least 10 messages from a listener not every listener will do that and cooperate to help that member reach the chat requirement and so a member is left aimlessly wandering around messaging listeners and hoping those numbers happen within the chat or there can be a thread a roll call asking any listeners who are willing to help people out with the 30 message 10/10 requirement and will commit to that with each member wanting to get back into the chatrooms

i think theres some idealistic assumptions that this is just going to naturally happen here with listeners

stressBear November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8 My prediction is that people who are only here for the chat rooms and not the listeners are just going to leave. Pretty much the same as what's happening with the feed.

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@Moonlitrose1

sorry correction the requirement its 5 chats with 5 different listeners minimum 30 messages in the chat - with a minimum of 10 messages sent to the listener and 10 recieved from that listener basically you need to count 10 sent and 10 recieved and 30 or more messages any listener you talked to before that didnt agree or wont finish this it wont count as a " chat " in this quota that admin doesnt want to hasnt planned to help with or even explain to members ...

quietCloud22 November 8th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8

This is all starting to sound like a Monty Python sketch

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@quietCloud22

definately lol yes

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@quietCloud22

definately lol yes

jennysunrise8 November 8th, 2019
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@quietCloud22

lol yes

stressBear November 9th, 2019
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@TheMadQueen420 They finally got pinned down on that one -- it's five chats total: one with each of five different listeners. "Chat" is defined as 30 messages, including at least 10 from the member and 10 from the listener.

jennysunrise8 November 9th, 2019
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@stressBear

since its 10 messages someone has to get from a listener (and sent to the listener) and not just 30 messages it would probabally be a good idea when people message the listener to say right in the beginning - " will you accept a chat with me trying to get back into chatrooms and a chat is at least 30 messages 10 from you or it wont count if your willing message me back please " and just copy and paste this intro message to listeners and those listeners who agree to that counting will message back if not its going to take a lot longer if its not planned out and just all left up to chance and no wonder people are having so many chats but not getting the badge it was a chat but maybe they only sent 7 messages and the listener only sent 9 so it doesnt count it all has to be a certain numbers to count towards a "chat"

also a member can start a thread here asking for listeners who will agree to do 30+ and send at least 10 messages to them to contact > https://www.7cups.com/forum/GeneralSupport_28/MembersClassifieds_360/

stressBear November 9th, 2019
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@jennysunrise8 The thread in classifieds sounds like a good idea. It still leaves open the question of whether I'm capable of sustaining a conversation for that long.

RarelyCharlie November 9th, 2019
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@stressBear It doesn't have to be a conversation. Here are some 20-line poems you can copy and paste line by line Zany Then you only need 5 listeners who are happy to make random remarks and to heart some of the lines.

This could be semi-automated, obviously.

Charlie

RarelyCharlie November 9th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie Darn! Forgot the link: Famous 20 Line Poems

Charlie

stressBear November 9th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie Well, that's one way of gaming the system... Might be worth a try.

RarelyCharlie November 9th, 2019
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@stressBear Oh, you write your own poems, I see Grinning with big eyes Feel free to recite one to me, if you wish, and I will provide 10 lines of constructive literary criticism!

The more serious point being that a dedicated h4x0r troll only needs five listener bots and a poem-reciting member bot to create unlimited chat-authorized accounts. It can even be the same poem each time.

Charlie

stressBear November 9th, 2019
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@RarelyCharlie Doesn't even have to be a poem -- random numbers would do. Or the script for the bot!

jennysunrise8 November 9th, 2019
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@stressBear

it doesnt have to be a long message you might be used to writing a lot in messages but you could break it up you could make a message sent one sentence or a paragraph its up to you or it could even be just a few words and the conversation wouldnt be too long - like my paragraph above that could be sent in one message but i could easily break all that up and send it in 10 or more messages even and you can message me if you want to for a chat :)

stressBear November 9th, 2019
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... actually, it seems that I can.

jennysunrise8 November 9th, 2019
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@stressBear

lol i knew you could do it bear yes

ArachnoChronos November 8th, 2019
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Here's my all encompassing solution against trolls that will benefit everyone... Just make it a monthly subscription thing. Like a token sum of just 14.99 $ a month in order to have access to the chats.. This will not only solve your financial problems with the site, but it will eliminate trolls since they dont like putting anything on the line. Everybody wins

Harry53 November 8th, 2019
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@GlenM I am sorry to hear about this revenue issue.. I am sure that, under your leadership, this issue will be resolved and 7 cups will continue to be the wonderful website it has been for so many years now. We have full confidence in you. Keep up the good work, Glenn!

Misthios November 8th, 2019
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I have only recently joined 7 cups, but my first experience with listeners was not good. It took a long time for someone to connect with me, and when they did the did not reply. I was just sat here looking at the chat and nothing happened. However, when i joined a group chat I was welcomed and people were really friendly and helpful, even if I had a hard time accepting their help.
The loss of the group chats makes me less willing to use the site, to be honest. After all, my best experiences so far have been in the group chats. I might try the listeners a bit more, but I feel like this place got a lot colder and more shut off now. We'll see how long i'll stay.

pinkTiger1749 November 8th, 2019
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For me personally the Group Chats were the strongest feature of this site. Currently many listeners are underwhelming to talk to and the forums are ok for posting thoughts but the chats made for interactive real time discussions. I'm not sure if I'm really willing to suffer through 5 chats with 5 listeners just to gain access to a chat that has little segregation bassed on issue or concern.

CreativeField2019 November 8th, 2019
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@GlenM what was the scale down because I cannot see any group chatrooms at all to join.

FreeHelp November 8th, 2019
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Hope you are having a good day @GlenM

pamharley003 November 9th, 2019
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As a Moderator in a chat room it is not always easy to do when I am reported for following what I was trained not only as a Listener but as a Mod. Some Members feel it is their room when it is a support room for everyone. Some feel it is okay to discuss topics that may trigger others and members telling anyone including myself to leave the room.

I have been a Listener for almost 2 years and some Members do not follow the rules, they feel they do not have to but everyone else does. So it is a double standard here. Also it is unfair when Members say all Listeners do not do this or are not that, when I am a empathtic Listener and care for those I have 1-1 chats.

quietCloud22 November 9th, 2019
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@pamharley003

I have always appreciated your leadership in our chat room. You've always tried to be fair and supportive. A thousand hearts to you, Pam!