Bullying
Why I am not seeking any support in groups anymore.
Trigger Warning: mention of suicide (other people, not myself)
Yesterday in the afternoon, I sought support on a group chat, my beloved Sharing Circle. At least, it used to be “beloved.”
I did bring up my issue I was hoping to toss into the group for what is usually intelligent and supportive feedback. Very quickly, the topic of the group conversation became: Bullying.
Which was fine, when it was us exploring our own attitudes towards bullying and what we were doing about them, but less so, when one of the participants in the Sharing Circle started engaging in vicious bullying of their own.
I felt compelled, in my mind, to defend a person I knew well, who was not standing down, and who called out the bully. I am proud of that person. I didn’t, at that moment in time, have the personal resources to do or say anything beyond that. I tried to share a story about a bully who got Karma, but then later, after exiting the Sharing Circle, my mind turned to another case, that had a much less rosy ending, where the boy turned to suicide as his solution for long-lasting bullying he was enduring at his school. My mind also turned to a beloved co-worker, who took her own life after being bullied by, of all people, her own husband.
These thoughts made me feel very sad. And the sadness has persisted to today, when I am still feeling this mourning of the loss of these two souls, along with other souls (would you like me to list them?) who have died at their own hand because of being bullied: by others, by society, by their own families, by their terrible feeling of unworthiness.
Sometimes I am sad anyway about the turn society seems to take, with bullies being rewarded for their bad actions.
Also, I didn’t like it that it took at least fifteen minutes for a Community Mod to show up after they had been called.
I’m tired of reporting this sort of thing.
I’m tired of taking screen shots. I’m tired of trying to keep up with people who have rogue accounts or who create accounts just to pester, bother and torment other people who are coming here for support. Some really mean and manipulative people out there. Who needs that energy?
I’m tired of seeing my friends leave this site because they have been bullied terribly.
All of this is wearing out my soul.
I will take a rest now. Perhaps I will deactivate my account. Perhaps not. I have a choice.
I already know that it will do no good to “report.” This has proven to be like a Timeless and Endless Vortex of Shame and Uselessness when I have done it.
So, I will withdraw from this site until I have found my own Center and Ground again.
Which will surely happen.
In the meantime, to the Bullies, I would like to say this:
1. Don’t mock people.
2. Don’t taunt or tease people about the things they are sensitive about. That’s mean.
3. If you have nothing nice to say here, don’t say anything.
4. Stop picking fights.
5. Leave this site for people who are seeking support.
6. Your actions as a Bully are not welcome here.
7. I am angry at your actions, and I choose to not engage.
8. I will not mute you, because you are, sadly, part of society.
9. I will tolerate you, but in the case of this website, I have a choice, so I will not enter groups for now.
10. I will continue to live, and I will live well in spite of your sad attempts at mocking and meanness.
11. Go away.
12. When you figure how to act better, maybe you can come crawling back.
13. You possibly will find people to help you, or you will find people who Remember and who seek Justice. And Justice will be Served.
Sincerely yours,
Patience
@PatienceImpatiens hugs you tightly ❤❤ yeah! Bullying is terrible in any situation. I too have lost people who took their lives😥 your such a sweet, important person to 7 cups and to me. To avoid being bullied I don't do 1-1 chats anymore, and I tend to spend a lot more time in forum land than in the group chats. Maybe try that for a little while🙂 or just take a break for a little while ❤I'll be waiting for your return ❤ I love you
@Tinywhisper11
Dear Lola,
It makes me sad that on a site that is for mental health support, you don't feel safe engaging in 1:1 chats. But I totally understand it! There is little or no oversight on chats, not like on Crisis Lines. In fact, I found out that Listeners can enter gibberish into their responses and they will still be allowed to become Listeners. This was shocking and terrible information to me.
The Forums at least have the advantage of being more permanent. If someone says something, it stays, unless it goes against guidelines.
I support whatever anyone needs to do to feel safe.
Kindly, and with a return, very furry and soft hug, (And yes, if you want to, you can eat the flowers. They are not poisonous.)
Patience
@Tinywhisper11
Dear Lola,
I have a perfect song for you if one of your carers will help you to find it on a site that is allowed for you. It's called "Perfect Day" by Duran Duran.
Here are the lyrics. It's a really beautiful and calming song.
Drink sangria in the park
Then later, when it gets dark
We go home
Feed animals in the zoo
Then later a movie, too
And then home
I'm glad I spent it with you
Such a perfect day
You just keep me hanging on
You just keep me hanging on
Problems all left alone
Weekenders on our own
Such fun
You made me forget myself
I thought I was someone else
Someone good
I'm glad I spent it with you
Such a perfect day
You just keep me hanging on
You just keep me hanging on
You're gonna reap just what you sow
You're gonna reap just what you sow
You're gonna reap just what you sow
You're gonna reap just what you sow
@PatienceImpatiens I just listened to it on Amazon music ❤❤ and added it to my good morning playlist😁 it's beautiful thankyou ❤❤ I've not heard of duran Duran before. It's a great song ❤ thanks for thinking about me ❤ hugs you tightly ❤I love you ❤
@PatienceImpatiens
hugs Pat, you have gone through so much, I feel proud of you for writing about this, you are so right, the bullying is so hard to endure and it makes the people who are already going through so much in life more sad. Hugs Pat, I love you and support you.
@PatienceImpatiens I'm so sorry this happened to you. Bullying isn't something anyone should have to deal with here. It's so hard when our safe spaces are taken from us. It makes it hard to speak up and makes us hesitant to seek support
It shouldn't have taken so long for a mod to show up. That's really disappointing
@mytwistedsoul
Soul,
I've thought more about what you said here and also came to a realization on my own.
We all carry with us some trauma wounds. Of course, it's things we may be deeply ashamed to admit. It takes a certain climate of trust to admit these things, a vulnerability of sorts. This sharing can come about when a person is bursting. Many of the calls I get on Crisis Lines are when a person is at the end of their rope and they just have to tell someone.
Ideally, the Sharing Circles, or any Therapeutic Group for that matter, would have some ground rules of trust, of keeping information that is shared in the room in the room, of some sort of cohesion and faith that there would be someone there to help work through the difficult emotions. But, alas, most hours, the Sharing Circles are left in the hands of: volunteers, who have no training in psychotherapy, or Community Mods, who tend to "gloss over" and "rush along" conversations to keep things light, or they use their "moderator tools" to delete awful comments, but those of us who are fast readers have read them anyway, so it's too late, and the opportunity for "working through" any difficult feelings that arise is really lost.
This works to the advantage of the website, which relies on character count to survive. In other words, the more people participate, the more money the website makes. It is a for profit, and you do realize that.
So, the chats keep going, limping on, in their way.
The website itself, keeps going, attracting more and more vulnerable people, because we exist.
But the therapeutic benefit may not be there.
Because that, in and of itself, is not important as a priority.
If it was, then there would be more attention and emphasis on making the groups solid and therapeutic. I could refer you to my recent reading material, "“THE THEORY AND PRACTICE OF GROUP PSYCHOTHERAPY 6th Edition" by IRVIN D. YALOM and MOLYN LESZCZ, BASIC BOOKS, NEW YORK.”
It's not what I would call "light reading." And, I did attempt to start a thread about my perceptions while I was reading it, but I realized quickly that there would be little to no engagement with my thoughts.
So, being practical, I gave up!
Kindly,
Patience
@PatienceImpatiens You're absolutely right. These are thoughts I've been having myself recently. I understand that there's time constraints with discussions in chats and with the sharing circle - which I know the sharing circle is operated differently than a lot of the other chats so everyone can have a turn. There are times though - as you said - that difficult feelings are brought up and there's no opportunity to work through them. You're left with them - of course they'll tell you to contact a listener if you need but wouldn't it be better to work through them as a group? Especially if they were the same people there?
@mytwistedsoul
Soul! Thank you so much for engaging with me on this topic!
I agree with everything you said, including the part about being "dismissed" because it was a heavy emotion.
I think that's part of the reality of our society, and even this website, which is supposed to be for the purpose of mental wellness, are: 1. in business, and 2. dismissive of deeper, more existential questions.
Thank you for affirming that.
Also, thank you for your dialogue.
Someone sent me a link to a post from 2017 and I noticed that there was much more engagement in the post, even though the engagement was superficial, at least it was there.
So far, you are the only person (and, thank you for that) along with a very few others, who has engaged with this very important topic of: Bullying on the Group Chats.
To me, that is an indicator of its importance in the scheme of things.
It's Not Important. To Them.
Kindly,
Patience
@PatienceImpatiens This is actually one of the nicest indepth conversations I've had here in a very long time :) Its been awhile since I've had one of these
@mytwistedsoul
Soul, We have the Collapsible Posts now! Let's drink to that, but not too heartily or some of our Posts might collapse!
Thank you for being a Friend!
Love,
Patience
@PatienceImpatiens LOL! Cheers! You're welcome and thank you too! ❤️
@mytwistedsoul
Thanks, Soul, it didn't happen to me, except subtly.
But another person got the brunt of the vitriol.
I have given up on the groups being "therapeutic."
My problem was that I was too long stuck in this "vision" of what groups "could be like" and when confronted with what they "are," the disconnect is so vast!
@PatienceImpatiens Thank you for sharing your experiences, Pat. I am so sorry to hear about the hurtful experiences you have had. Dealing with bullying both directly and indirectly can take a huge emotional toll on anyone. Feeling tired of reporting issues and seeing friends leave due to mistreatment is completely understandable. My heart goes out to all those who have suffered from bullying, bullying is a big no.
Please know we are all against bullying and do not accept it. everyone is accountable and responsible for their behavior here. If we notice any bullying situation, please do report it as it not only helps us to take necessary actions to address it but also firm up our boundaries so that we do not encourage bullying behavior in our community. We come here together to support each other and share.
@ASilentObserver
Indeed.
I feel your remorse, slightly.
Let me respond by telling a Little Story.
I’m an Elder adult. I take great joy and solace in ice skating. Right! You may be laughing because maybe for an Elder, I have to develop all new muscles. A lifetime of Running, Tennis, Swimming, Skiing and Karate didn’t prepare me even a little bit to balance my whole Life on a thin Blade.
In short, the Rink is my Second World. I go into the Rink and I feel like a Princess. Over time, it has been about two years now since I strode into this new sport, I have made some Friends.
My Friends are about my age, so we have age-related aches and pains. Also, we have enjoyed some successes, like learning a new move, figuring out how to condition ourselves better, and we are ruthless in evaluating all the various Skating Instructors that ply for our business as Students.
One of my Friends had, over the past weeks, bought some new and Expensive Skates. The first day I saw her, she was so excited to try them! But after the Skate, she was full of complaints. The skates pinched in the toe and the arch. The heel was too tight. She planned to go back to the shop to maybe stretch out the Skate and have it adjusted.
Next time I saw the same Friend, I asked her how her New Skates were. She recounted her dramatic visit to the Shop, where they stretched out the Skates, re-positioned the Blade, something which was surely throwing her off. But she was still in pain in spite of all the adjustments, the Skates were still pinching some of her toes, her feet were both in pain constantly, and she was re-thinking entirely the whole adventure of Ice Skating. Maybe she was Too Old. Maybe this was Not for Her.
I listened closely and then suggested something.
I suggested to my Friend to try to Listen to herself as she talked about the discomfort of the Skates. I wondered out loud to my Friend, if the Skates were her Boyfriend, would she Keep them?
She laughed and said instantly, “I would Break up!”
In the same way, I have tried with Sharing Circles. I had High Hopes for Sharing Circles because of the origin from Councils of Indigenous Peoples. I was one of the Top Hosts on the Leaderboard for 2023 (ask Lou!). I made numerous attempts to make things better in the Sharing Circles. I sent a long and detailed letter to you, Obs, to Glenn, and to Lou73, about changes I thought should be made in oversight to offer better training for Listeners, and also better in the moment oversight for Listeners during the chats and especially within Groups.
(I did not agree that Artificial Intelligence would provide good oversight, that it would have to be a Human Counselor, with some special training in group dynamics and Group Therapy. I’m mentioning this because it’s so tempting to use Computers to solve all our Problems, when the Problems Originate with Humans.)
However, as my Friends have left, gradually, I consider Sharing Circle to be a Bad Boyfriend, and I am Breaking Up. I’m Breaking up with beating my skull against the wall in frustration as I suggest time after time, tweaks that would provide needed improvements.
I have given up.
This release from looking at Sharing Circles as anything other than an Obligation for me to help with my skills to run things better, as versus a place I can ever Receive support, has created a certain Wild Freedom in my Soul. Today, I told my Friend, I feel like a Happy Sunbeam, who has sat my Foe, Anger, down after giving a hug as to a Child, and given my Anger some Tea. We have had a Jolly time and are Friends now. I may or may not have given Anger a toast with organic strawberry jam, and I may or may not have slipped some Honey into the Tea. My Anger also thinks I should Break Up, and at Last Report, Anger and I were Laughing together at how Silly and Absurd it was that anyone could solve our Problems but Ourselves.
I wish you all the Best.
Love and Courage,
Patience
P.S. And, I’m still Breaking Up.
Patience, first of all lemme just say thank you for spreading this awareness I agree with your post and I liked the list's you made I nodded my head and opened my eyes wide when I read them. I really felt it. I have to admit it that puppet accounts are being made and they are cowardly people behind a phone screen or a computer and they know what they are doing, they are bored and they are upset with themselves so they choose to tether thier pain on vulnerable people who suffer efficiently bad here with thier issues and they do it knowing they are winning. Hence why I left for a while before. It was puppet accounts and newbies who just wanted attention and I pity them just bcuz they must really have a conscience to go around spreading negative energy and making the atmosphere from being a blessing to being cloudy and unenergetic. I don't like bullying and never have, especially those who go around bullying elder people for no reason and getting at them it makes me infuriated. I'm very sorry that it has affected you also and others who go out thier way to be kind to those who we don't know to make them feel apart of the activity and atmosphere. Be well my friend and if anyone upsets you then @calmrosebud will bring her silver backs and I'll bring gibbons too lol idk what gibbons will do lol 😂 but I hope you are okay my friend, nice to hear from you also. Your friend in time, Cal
@CallumKing2000
Cal, Your Gibbons are just the picture I needed to Laugh this morning. Bring on the Gibbons! Also, it's good to know you read this because I agree, any Bullying is unacceptable, if anything we all try to understand each other even when it's difficult or there's a language barrier or even if a Person is feeling so many Emotions that it's difficult to find the Language for it, and we just need someone to Sit with us.
I want us all to have Safe Spaces.
I know this is Difficult.
It's a Wild World out there and many Challenges.
Patience sets up a Cozy Nest for the Gibbons and for Cal, and brings Friends and Snacks and lots of Warm Blankets. Patience would light a Fire, but the Gibbons don't seem to like that. They seem to like Hot Chocolate! In cups, and the one Gibbon is holding their Pinky finger out like they are Royalty. But they are a little Splashy. I don't think they drink from Cups too much!
Practice makes Perfect.
Love,
Patience
You shouldn't have to leave because of other people. Don't let them drive you OUT. Don't be intimidated. I understand tho. Do what YOU have to do to protect YOURSELF. How can we help?
@Phylomena
Hi, Phiylomena,
"Other People" can be Vicious and Cruel. I just don't like when they are like that. Poo poo on the Mean Ones. When I am in the Groups I somehow want everyone to be safe, but if I have come there because I Myself am Seeking Support, I would have liked to know it's a Safe Space.
It was just the "straw that broke the Camel's Back."
I have "broken up" with the Groups for now. I just won't seek support there and I will only go when I feel Strong.
What I used to think was that it was what the "least of us" was thinking that was also important to consider. But one has to have a certain Resilience to enter a Group of People.
Thank you for offering your Support.
Patience
