7 Cups Sharing Circles are now LIVE!

@Mediclife @SharpiePen I'm going to start a new topic for people to share suggested openings & closings and feedback so it's easier to separate that from the discussion here.

I have joined the sharing circles and then quickly left them. They got really uncomfortable for me from the start it seemed really religious and that first bit was uncomfortable. I left this until now to share after going into a few sharing circles with different hosts and still feeling the same way. The word love still with it being in a prayer like form and even I understand people they.. are saying yes you can agree to it or not but in the end I have read all the comments and numerous people are feeling the same way as me in this situation. Yes you guys want to be inclusive of everyone but ... maybe getting rid of some parts may help out as people do need to feel safe on site or maybe... make it in not one of the 24/7 rooms and put a caption that religionous type messages are shared because that is what it is seeming in all the sessions. This is just my chunck im sure may others will have more to say

- Sharpie

I made a thread over in Safety & Knowledge as this section of Group Support is for CMs to share information.

https://www.7cups.com/forum/SafetyKnowledgeat7Cups_181/QuestionsfromthecommunityAnsweredDiscussedhere_36/SharingCirclesHowtoOpenClosethem_218747/

Hopefully there's some interest to collectively come up with something that can be unique to 7cups and suitable for what we are.

@AffyAvo I like that

Just cross-posting a suggestion I mentioned in group chat re: the Serenity thing.

Maybe the leaders can come up with a pool of inspirational quotes to use and rotate through them at the beginning and end.

@BlueRaspberry27253 I think that would be a great idea!

@Heather225 how can i enter the teen community?

@Heather225 What a great idea! Love this

Please could my mute be unlocked I'm waiting to join in the group chats 😔

All - quick update on the sharing circles and some additional context. We've reviewed some of the concerns here and we will soon be rolling out two sharing circle times that do not have any of the serenity language and will instead have different positive affirmations. Look for more details on this soon!

Second, in terms of context, there are a few things to unpack here. 7 Cups supports people from all walks of life. We are a platform. We want people to feel comfortable here no matter their background or beliefs. We do this now to some extent with sub-communities. The structure or format is the same, but different groups use sub-communities for different reasons. Similarly, with groups, we provide over 125 moderated discussions a week. Some of these are fun, some of these focus on a topic like anxiety and others on skill development like mindfulness.

We have just started the sharing circles which are offered in the tradition of AA/NA/OA. They are helpful for a variety of issues. There is a long history of these groups and the format that has been around since the late 1930s. Moreover, these groups have helped millions of people. The NYT just covered a new review that suggests they are even more helpful than long thought. You can read that article here. Even the little bit of data we have so far on the sharing circles on 7 Cups is compelling. People seem to enjoy them, find them meaningful, and helpful. Finally, groups like sharing circles are routinely offered in health systems around the world and clinics where there is no particular belief system endorsed by the health system. They provide the groups to people that find them helpful. We are following that same process here on 7 Cups. We provide lots and lots AND lots of different resources and supports - we trust people to engage in the ones that they find helpful and avoid the others.

I hope this extra context is helpful and I hope you all have a good rest of the weekend!

@GlenM I found this interesting and helpful, and I agree with you that 7 Cups must support all kinds of people, no matter their background or beliefs. These backgrounds do, of course, include religious backgrounds.

However, I think it's very important not to miss the point here. The point, it seems to me, is that non-religious people felt ambushed by the religious tone of this new initiative. It's not that the religious tone is wrong in any way—some people genuinely value it—but there was no warning on the packaging about what the contents would include. So in my view this was, yet again at 7 Cups, a communications failure.

The research on AA is also interesting, if you read it in slightly more depth than NYT journalists tend to do. AA's own surveys have always indicated a very high drop-out rate, 75% or more. There's some more detailed information here and additional discussion here.

I think it follows that if 7 Cups imports ideas from AA, then 7 Cups can also expect a lot of people not to like those ideas. This doesn't mean the ideas are wrong, only that they don't suit most people. It is not a surprise that AA doesn't suit most people! AA has always openly admitted this!

Unfortunately this also means the new Cochrane review reported in the NYT is also suspect, because (as the authors acknowledge) it made no attempt to control for publication bias. Any study of AA with realistic drop-out rates of 75% or more is extremely unlikely to have been published, and therefore it never would have been included in the review. The review's main conclusion relied on published studies with drop-out rates lower than 20%, which are obviously not typical of AA in the real world. So, although I am not an expert, I don't imagine this review will be considered authoritative.

Charlie

@RarelyCharlie Plus there are a number of people who would not go to AA simply due to abuses done to them by religious groups in the past. For example, those who attended residential schools in Canada.

I have no problem if 7cups wants to have some areas that have a religious aspect to them. There is a prayer thread in trauma support. But I totally agree here on not surprising people with it.

I also think for something like this, it's nice to make it as comfortable for as great as a population as we can. If there was enough support to have more sections run then it wouldn't be as problematic to have some using the AA wording, as long as it was obvious to people before joining.

Firstly, I think it's great that there is at least an attempt here to listen to the feedback here.

I don't think there is much evidence for AA working. Aren't the estimates from AA that they only actually help 5 to 10 % of people? There are other methods of treatment for addictions that have better success rates that that and are more evidence based. It's cool if some people like the group support though. It doesn't have to be a treatment to be helpful. But AA is based on Christianity, and the fact it is a religious organization has been determined as fact by a court of law in the USA.

Again I am actually fine with AA being here, but it should be clear that's what it is from the start, and that it's religious so that people who want to can avoid that. I am lucky that I have healed enough that I'm no longer easily triggered, but I was abused by a religious cult as a child, and I wasn't expecting to hear a prayer when I first went into that chat. Maybe I should have guessed. And when I mentioned in chat that the serenity prayer was religious, I was told it wasn't. That it was just an affirmation. Changing the word God to the word Love doesn't change the fact it is a prayer written by a theologian, and that first appeared in a book of sermons. I felt like they were gaslighting me. Maybe I am being too sensitive, but I can't help but wonder if this is an attempt to get people involved in AA by the backdoor, rather than being upfront about it. If this isn't meant to be AA, why bother defending AA and saying it helps people?

I'd say it's still possible the idea of the sharing circles could be used in a way that is helpful. But you either need to completely decouple the idea with AA, or openly hold AA meetings for those who want to attend them and have them clearly signposted as that. AA does secular meetings as well, so they could be non-religious in order to be more inclusive, but if it's based on AA then it will have religious elements to it (e.g... the confessing of sins and so on...). I think it would be better to drop the idea of copying AA and just try to develop your own 7 Cups style of Sharing Circle. It's possible that that is what is now intended by dropping the prayer?

MY JOB IS NOT BRINGING ME MUCH MONEY RIGHT NOW.

@Heather225

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@Heather225 *

@allyswift hi I'm new to this what can I post about on this thread ?

Hi! I've gone to 12 steps for many years.... I believe people are misunderstanding the term "higher power" which is a self-defined term. I think because all languages are rooted with history and connotations, it is hard to find a word in the English language (which is a language itself tied historically to Christianity), that is free of a religious connotation.

I can just say, I have been to different 12 step recovery meetings and met all different people of religion, ethnicity, culture, and met people who were agnostics, as well as atheists... who were happily in our group. We were all able to exist peacefully and to respect each other. It actually was super healing to share about some of the religious trauma that happens in the world and to hear others share. No one was turned away. We all respectfully listened or took care of ourselves and left the room if we got triggered.

I've heard (altered for anonymity) "Higher Power" can be anything one defines - from one's support group, one's home group, circle of trusted friends, to a super hero, to a religious God, to a personally caring God, to a detached universe of Darwanism, mother nature, the universe, all the way to a door knob, dust bunny. The important thing is HP was accepted as self-defined and no one questions that. People were also welcome to substitute their definition in place of the word "HP" and some people did that.

Yes, AA was rooted in Christian beliefs... I find, however, that the spiritual principles of surrender is something shared across many cultures, religions, and philosophies. So my vote would be to alter the serenity prayer but keep it, "HP (or inserting any word of one's choice) grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.

Just my 2 cents :) Of course 7cups is wonderfully innovatively and uniquely made and of course is meant to be perfect for its members, so I stand behind what the community wants. Just wanted to chime in that my experience of 12 steps was not religous but spiritual! And that it took me some time to be able to feel the difference!

hi

@kjii Hi! I noticed you are new! Just wanted to say welcome!!! :)

hi 👋🏻@Flowingstreams thank u 😊.

@kjii

my pleasure! Hope you like it here! 😊

I'm very depressed

hi hugs @Charmingplum4444

why u depressed?are u ok ?is everything ok?

@Charmingplum4444

Hope today is a better day today!

Why do the sharing circles need to have any spiritual framework at all? It still contains a prayer, still refers to AA, encourages users to answer in a way similar to religious meetings and ends with a spiritual sentence.

This very much contradicts the strict "no religion" policy that's been clearly enforced for as long as I've been an active user in group chat. Suddenly 7 Cups itself sneaks it in to group chat? I'm confused.

As Glen said in his post, "groups like sharing circles" are offered in health systems throughout the world. I've been to professional group therapy in the public healthcare system in Norway. Every spiritual element is removed, and none of the elements I mentioned above are included. All it is is this - the participants share their story one at a time and nobody interrupts or comments.

I don't see why it can't be done completely neutral here too. Skip the mantra, skip the prayer, don't mention AA at all and let users choose their own three word answers instead of abbreviated templates. Then we'd have an actual neutral sharing circle.

I think that would be more comfortable for more people than the current form.

@GoingSafari

I want to add I'm very happy with the concept otherwise. It's a great concept, and a great way to get a proper little window to share and all attention is on you. Especially for the users who are shy to share in group chat, of which there are many. I was one and it took me a long time to not be scared of sharing when people are responding or not responding in so many different ways.

@GoingSafari I completely agree with you. The way it's set up now feels like they are trying to promote AA to us.

Also, I definitely think the sharing circle should be in a pop-up room. The flow of a sharing circle is so strictly enforced and different to the normal chat flow, so it's confusing to both regular and new users. When the title of the room is "Sharing Circle", it's much more clear that this is a specific thing. But the most important reason is this: Banners don't appear in the mobile app! So it's very easy to interrupt the circle without meaning to.

@GoingSafari

Also, where do we go for regular supportive chat if we don't want the very concentrated support chat that a sharing circle is? MCR is supposed to be and usually is more light-hearted. I definitely think it would be better with a pop-up room all and all.

@GoingSafari

I agree with safari on all those points. Especially that the sharing circle should be a pop up room like mindfulness and other hour long discussion based rooms. So that it won't interrupt the regular chats and those who need immediate and elaborate support in the support room. I think its not fair to make them wait till they get their turn also suppose if the queque is full they need to wait for an whole hour to share and get support and since its also mentioned that MCR is for light hearted chats its hard to get support there. I also feel those abbreviated replies to sharer is not enough of a support, usually we support by giving out elaborate views and insights, its more useful and supportive that way , these kind of restrictions and time limits makes it harder to share and get required support. Hope you all consider these feedbacks and let these sessions happen in separate pop ups dedicated for these type of structured shares. I think it will be easier for mods too since they get occupied in support room during the circle and they couldn't be fully present in MCR.

I popped into the middle of a sharing circle a few days aga and it seemed to run wonderfully! Everone seemed very pleased and supported.

In the past i avoided the chat rooms because when i entered support rooms, there were times when people were having separate conversations, and it was hard to tell who was talking to whom, and how many different conversations were happening. There were also times one person who was very emotional or venting would be the only person sharing and everyone else just listening and replying (1-3) and the rest of the people quiet (other 10+ people).. Other times someone would be trying to be serious and have a serious issue, but other members would be goofing around and making jokes and distracting the conversation.

I thought the boundaries and adherence to the guidelines made it feel more productive, more equitable, and safe! It was just pure sharing without advice giving with boundaries and seemed to work great! Great job! 🙏🏼😊

Hey- im new here

@EricDuhhh

Hi Eric!!! Just wanted to say hello and welcome :) Glad you are here! :) !

I am new to this. I joined because I am depressed, constantly worried and have major anxiety. I read that this was free. I worry that there is fine print somewhere that will cost? Can someone answer me on this. Thank you.

ZB

@affectionateAcres1423 There are a few things that have costs associated but it's clear if you try to use those.

There are professional therapists, these are different than the listeners. Therapy is $150 USD/month.

There is a subscription, that opens up specific growth paths.

On occasion there are workshops offered by a therapist, there haven't been any of these for a while.

There is merchandise you can buy.

None of these are required to use the site and are all upfront about the fact they are not free. Many people have used the site for a long time without paying for anything.

Hi

How are you?

Hello!

I have learned alot

here and fairly good conversations !