One Sided Friendship?
Hi! This is my first post here. I hope everyone who reads this is having a wonderful day, and if you're not I'm sending virtual hugs <3. I was just hoping to make a thread where I can vent a little about a friendship problem I'm having and maybe come back and update later. Advice/comments are welcome if you have them, but please be gentle :)
Ok, here we go. First off, here's some background for context. I honestly only have a couple of friends who stayed in contact after high school. I commute a fair distance to my university every day, so although I've made some very casual friends there, it's been hard to foster anything more than that. My job is one that is mostly executed alone, but there are coworkers who I am friendly with. But really, it's just the three or so friends from high school that I feel close to. One of the main ones was a friend I'll call Alice for the purpose of this thread.
Alice and I have been friends for nearly 8 years now. For the most part, I really enjoy our friendship. We have similar interests that I don't share in common with almost anyone else, and we've got a lot of common history to bond over. She shares things with me about her life that (according to her) she doesn't share with anyone else besides her therapist. I'm so glad she feels safe enough around me to do that.
But the thing is that for a long time, especially these last couple of years, I've really been feeling like the friendship is one sided. She always vents to me, but there's only been a handful of times where she's given me a chance to vent to her. I'm almost always the one to initiate contact or to try to arrange time to spend together, or to remember birthdays and things like that. Because of that, I feel like an afterthought in her life. I was really lonely, and it felt like I wasn't getting any support or acknowledgement from her.
The final straw for me to fully realize why I wasn't happy was honestly really small. I sent Alice a text asking how she was, nothing else, and I didn't get a single response for almost a week. When she finally did text me, she completely ignored my previous text and just boasted about a small victory in her life. Don't get me wrong, I was happy for her. But I felt unimportant. And after she finished being excited over the thing in her life, she stopped texting. It feels petty to care about, but she didn't even ask how I was doing.
I was so tired. I spent senior year of high school feeling incredibly lonely but doing my best to cater to her needs at the time because she was going through a rough patch. Unfortunately that included leaving her alone to sit in the band room with a bunch of her other friends because hanging out with me and the rest of our friend group was "too exhausting". I didn't want to be selfish and petty, but I was and am still just tired of it all.
So, I figured I'd stop contacting her. I'd let her come to me so I could take off that mental weight. I told myself that if she wanted to talk to me, she would. But almost three weeks and I still hadn't heard from her at all. It's like she forgot about me. But with Christmas coming up, and the fact that I would honestly feel terrible if I ignored her on the holiday instead of sending at least a "Merry Christmas", I did just that. Early Christmas morning, I sent her a "Merry Christmas".... and nothing. So late that night, I gave in and I asked if she was okay since I still hadn't heard from her.
She did eventually get back to me with the excuse that she'd been "so distracted by family she forgot to even look at her messages". Honestly, I would get it. I don't blame her if that's honestly what it was. But this is a pretty regular thing, and I had seen her like things on social media during that time anyways, so I know she at least had access to her phone and the time to scroll. Just apparently not to respond to me after three weeks of nothing.
But her response didn't do much for my resolve to let her come to me, and I kept the conversation going for a few texts (aka me asking how she was and how her Christmas was, her giving a vague "mostly good", me asking if she wanted to talk about it, her responding "eh it's all good", me saying something along the lines of "i hope it gets better", and then nothing).
I've been chatting with listeners here and I finally mustered up the courage to decide that the next time we spend time together, I'm going to confront her about it. I'm going to tell her how I've been feeling, and I'm going to tell her that unless things change, she can't expect me to keep putting effort into this friendship.
I've made the decision to do that, but I just feel so insecure about it. I'm worried I'm blowing all of this out of proportion. I'm sure that this entire post has been biased towards my side of things, so I'm worried that even if people who read this end up supporting me, it'll be wrong and it'll be my fault. I'm worried I'm just being a baby about this and what I really should do is man up and stop being weak. I'm worried it's all a skewed perception on my part because I honestly do have bad self-esteem. What if because I'm so anxious, I'm overthinking everything and in reality she's doing nothing wrong? Plus, this is a friendship. Is it normal to get so fired up over a friendship? Is there something wrong with me?
I just don't know what's right anymore. I feel stupid, weak, and clingy. I've made the decision to talk it out but since I can't actually see her until after the new year due to personal circumstances, I have to wait for a while. I'm fairly sure I'm going to chicken out in that time.
That's partly why I'm making this thread. I hope there will be people who will take the time to read this long and exhausting post to tell me what they think is really going on, and to keep me motivated. If you've read this far, thank you. I'd very much appreciate if you could let me keep you updated, but I understand if you don't want to do that. Thanks again for listening to me rant, and I hope you have a wonderful day <3
@cloverisconfused
I just accidentally deleted my entire response... the pain is real, but it's worth the retype.
Anywho...
I'm here because I had a confrontation with my Alice 2 days ago, and have since decided to take a break from everything and work on fixing my issues. I've only known my Alice for about 8 months, and I only lasted a week before messaging her back, which is when I had my awakening.
Some background of what my situation was; I would send gm/gn messages with the occasional "I hope you're doing okay". I never needed a reply from any of the messages, they were just to let them know I'm still alive, I care about them, and maybe make their day a bit better. Besides my Alice, I asked three of my other best friends (who I've known for 2 years, 8 months, and 2 months) and they said they were okay with it since they knew they weren't obligated to reply, and that it was just meant platonically; they pointed out though, that everyone might not see it that way, which validated my overthinking and why I was asking.
Well after about 5 days of no responses from my Alice and a bunch of overthinking that she suddenly hated me, I decided to see if everything was okay between us. Still nothing for another couple days, so I sent a short "are we okay" message. Now this is partially her fault because she chose not to tell me it bothered her, but my Alice then responded by telling me that it was pushy and annoying, and that it's something to say to your partner or family, not a friend.
I then did what I thought was right and apologized, and I've now stepped away and taken a break from communication with all my friends, so that I can work on myself and figure out how to be less emotionally reliant on my friends. Which on the one hand feels like I won't have very strong connections with my friends; but on the other hand, it means I won't make anyone I care about upset from this again, and overall that's what I want.
I also had some jealousy issues with my Alice, seeing her listening to music with someone all day for several days in a row. It brought up some nasty feelings of wanting to spend that much time with someone I cared about.
I did some self reflection and came to the conclusion that I don't really know how to be myself or happy without depending on one or more of my best friends. I decided to write down how I would like to treat others, how I would like to treat myself, what my flaws were, and what I wanted to focus on and take care of first. Turns out I treat others mostly how I would like to, giving them their space and relying on them for happiness are what I struggle with and need to work on. I treat myself almost the exact opposite of how I would like to, I overthink about every little thing and always get sad when I stop hanging out with my friends. Therefore, I have a lot I need to work on before I can comfortably feel ready to reconnect with my current best friends; I just hope I can figure all this stuff out before they forget about me.
Thanks for listening to/reading my rant about my situation. I actually would like to stay updated on how your situation and journey goes. I think something that helps you might also be beneficial to myself.
@Adam10999 oh the painnnn... I salute you for doing the hard work of retyping all of that
I'm sorry you've got your own Alice. I agree with you, I think it was partially her fault for letting it go on for so long without saying anything. I know people talk a lot about how we should all work on interpreting nonvocal social cues, and I know that it is important for a lot of things, but I think people don't communicate enough in general. It's unfair to expect anyone else to just know anything unless you tell them, so I definitely see where you're coming from.
I'm proud of you for apologizing and taking that step away. It's really hard to do, especially if you're doing it from all your friends. I'm not sure if I could do that for long. I think you're right - it is really scary to try to be less emotionally reliant on other people. Good job taking that first step :)
I'm glad I'm not the only one with jealousy issues. It feels shameful to talk about sometimes because jealousy is such a frowned upon emotion socially. To be honest, I've also been jealous with my Alice. After we graduated high school, she switched jobs and made a new friend there, one that she now spends more time with than she does with me. Funnily enough, that new friend and I are pretty similar personality-wise, although I think she's a bit milder and soft-spoken than me. I used to be more like that, but due to some family situations I was forced to learn to assert and enforce more boundaries. I think that's a good thing, but it was weird to see her become friends with someone that not only is similar to me, but is even more similar to the me I used to be. It made me feel like I was being replaced, like I'd become outdated and was no longer filling Alice's needs.
After some of my own self-reflection, I'm sorry to say i think we're in the same boat. Overthinking everything you do, people-pleasing unconsciously, etc. It really is hard to appreciate yourself and your own company. After all, even if it's not true (because it isn't), it feels like you can't be worth much if no one else can appreciate your worth, doesn't it? Like before, I'm really proud of you. It feels weird to say to a stranger on the internet, but I am. It takes a lot of courage to really look at yourself and admit whatever it is you see.
Thank you for listening to me first - I really appreciate it. Just as I predicted, I was starting to lose motivation to have that conversation with my friend, but this helped a little. I wish you good luck in working on yourself - please keep me updated, I would love to hear how things go for you <3 I'll keep you updated too, especially if I come across anything that helps with all of this
@cloverisconfused
You're working on your bachelor's degree and know a lot about your emotions and how you're feeling, so I'm sure you're very smart; you had the courage to talk about your feelings and make the decision to talk with your friend, so that shows you're very strong; and you weren't constantly checking up on her or demanding anything, so you're definitely not clingy. I also get being passive to prevent potential conflict, but I do hope you'll have that conversation with her and get this resolved; for the well being of both you and your friend.
Learning to assert boundaries, it's not an easy to do, and something I need to work on myself. Feeling like you are being replaced or that you aren't good enough is a tough struggle too; above all else though, you need to make the decisions that are best for you, even if that means letting that friendship go and maybe seeking a more nurturing one where you feel respected and valued.
I've also used my skills of "putting myself in other people's shoes" to help me get a jump start of feeling a bit better. I can sort of take all my emotions and values, set them aside, and make up essentially a whole new perspective (usually based on someone else) to see things pretty well from their point of view. Now, knowing how I want to treat others and myself, and what I want to work on and change; I have come up with a sort of alternate persona that encompasses those ideas while still holding onto who I am. It's given me a quick taste of what I'm looking for my life to be like, and although some of my previous concerns, about my friendships being less meaningful, still linger - I think I do actually like who I want to become, and I think the new me will be quite beneficial both to myself and others.
@Adam10999 No worries, it looks like overexplaining is another thing we have in common lol. I don't mind reading a long reply, so don't worry about it :) Mine will probably be long as well, so I apologize in advance.
I appreciate you taking another look and offering more advice/comments! Just one reply was already very helpful, so thank you for putting in the time and effort for another :)
Oh, boy, that is a lot of gas, and a lot of money. I'm very fortunate in that my university offers a free pass for my state's public transportation system, so even though it doubles my commute time plus some (😭) it takes a lot of pressure off of my finances. I really hope you can get your schedule down to 3 days a week!
I fully agree with you on trust in friendships. I think its so important - after all, friends are there to help each other through their darkest times and be a cheerleader, so if you can't trust them the relationship can feel a little pointless. For me personally, I also really need to know my friends trust me. If they don't trust me, I worry a lot about why that might be, and I tend to spiral. I really hope you can find a job soon and make some new friends. A fresh start can be exactly what you need sometimes. Good luck!
And yeah, being an afterthought does suck. I don't always need an entire conversation or anything, but like you said, I just need to know I'm being thought of and cared for. For me, my close friendships are such a crucial part of my life that I don't go a day without thinking about them. I find myself wishing that would go both ways, only to be disappointed a lot of the time.
I also go through a bit of a cycle of depression. I generally have about two-ish weeks where I'm okay, and then a similar amount of time where I'm very suddenly extremely lonely and depressed. I start out that low point by contacting all of my friends in an effort to stave off the loneliness, but when they inevitably don't respond or the little interaction I do get doesn't live up to my lofty expectations afterwards, I tend to become a bit of a hermit. All I want to do is be alone, preferably while wasting time being anything but productive. It's very strange, especially considering I usually start feeling okay again after a week or two, so I'm glad I'm not going crazy on my own with this.
As for talking to my friend, thank you for saying that! I really appreciate it. I just hope I can stick to my decision this time. Wish me luck haha
I really appreciate you saying that you don't think I've done anything wrong. It's so validating to hear, especially considering I've spent so much time worrying about it. My own anxiety and self-esteem are a beast, so I imagine I'll worry more, but I know it'll be extremely helpful to be able to refer back to this and remind myself.
I also needed to hear that about "manning up". I do tend to bottle up my emotions quite a bit - I always have, unfortunately. I've been trying these past few years to let myself be more open, and I've gotten better, but lately I've been reverting back to some older coping mechanisms. I'm still not sure why, but I'm working on figuring that out. I'm sorry you have the same tendency to bury your emotions. It's extremely taxing - mentally, emotionally, and physically. I hope you can take your own advice and keep doing your best to be open with your feelings. Whatever they are, you have a right and responsibility to yourself and others to feel them and communicate them in a healthy way. I believe in you!
And thank you again! I'm sure I sound like a broken record by now, but I really am just grateful for the validation. I'm sorry you've been feeling stupid, weak, and clingy as well - I think we both know it's no fun at all. But from what you've shown me I think I can also say with confidence you are not those things either. You've already shown you have the courage to have difficult conversations with the people you care about, and I admire that quality - it's hard to come by. You've been able to give them space as well, so you're not clingy. And I know you're also very intelligent as well. Not only intellectually, as is evidenced by the fact that you're also studying for your bachelor's in a difficult field, which is very impressive, but emotionally so, which you've shown you have in spades during our limited conversation. From what I've seen, you are very kind and empathetic towards others, but you're hard on yourself. I hope you can look at yourself with the same kindness and understanding that you do other people, because you do deserve it.
I think having regrets is totally understandable. I regret my mistakes as well, especially those I made towards my friends. i admire that you recognize what's done is done. That said, I know that knowing something is very different from really feeling it and appreciating it. I hope you can start to understand emotionally that it's okay to have made mistakes or wish you did things differently, and it doesn't make you a bad person or "undo" any of the good you did. Having regrets of your own doesn't excuse the mistakes of others, and as a third party looking at your situation, I can say with confidence that what happened was mostly on your Alice. You sound like a very genuine person who cares a lot about your friends and wants to make sure they know it, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. If they were uncomfortable they should have said something sooner instead of leaving you to wonder what you did wrong, and that's the end of it.
And I agree, overthinking is really a double-edged sword. Putting yourself in someone else's shoes is a really important ability. However, it also leaves you vulnerable to falling into the trap of subconsciously believing you know what they might be thinking, good or bad. I fall into that trap quite a bit, and it sounds like you might too. It is really scary, especially when your subconscious highlights all the bad and explains the good away. I'm also dealing with that same fear of the loss of meaning in my friendships that might occur with the loss of contact. I hope we can both remember that not only is that most likely not going to happen, but even if it does, it's just going to be a step in our long journey. We've swung too far one way and we'll probably have to go to the other extreme as well before we find a good balance in our friendships.
I agree. Like I said before, knowing things and feeling them are two different things. I've got the knowing part down - I know I need to do what's best for me. I've just got to work on feeling it. I hope you can too <3
I really relate to that line as well - I've been stuck with similar trains of thought before too, and I'm sorry you've done the same. It really is just a horrible loop of "if they don't like me, how can I, and if I don't like me, how can they?"
And of course! I appreciate your encouragement too, it really has been very helpful and comforting. I'm proud of you too! I can tell you've already done a lot of hard work on yourself during your life that has paid off, and I wish you luck on continuing that journey.
And again, no worries about the reading! I'm writing a lot too, and I'm not sure how much sense I'm making, so I'm sorry as well lol!
That's such a good exercise! I think I'll try doing that when I get the chance. And I'll definitely check out that podcast! I'm not much of a podcast person myself, but I've been trying a few out while looking for things to listen to while I work. So far, I've only really liked SciShow Tangents, so this will be a good one to add to my list. My schedule is kind of crazy and I'm not always able to listen to stuff while I work, but I'd also be open to discussing the episodes when I get a chance to listen to them!
That's another good exercise. I think being able to look at an alternate, ideal version of yourself and remind yourself of what you want to work towards is a really good asset to have. I'm glad you like who you want to become! I hope you can get closer and closer to that version of you smoothly.
As for my own self improvement... it's hard to describe in terms of exercises or anything I did on purpose. So far, it's been a chaotic mess of trial and error while I tried things out and did my best to maintain the mindsets/behaviors that felt right. I think something that's been really helpful to me is to try to stop making assumptions that other people are unhappy somehow. I really struggle with worrying about "oh well they said this but what if they just felt like they had to and they really feel this other way about it?". Of course, there are some things that are exceptions, but I mean as a general rule. For example, if I've asked for something I need, and the other person has agreed to it, then my job is to assume they don't have a problem with me. Even if I think that something in their tone of voice, for example, or maybe their body language seems upset. I've done my part to communicate what I need and ask for it respectfully, and they've agreed. If they have a problem or are unhappy with me in any way, it's their responsibility to talk to me about it. It's helped me to set boundaries and enforce them, even if I feel anxious or guilty about it. It's a small thing, and I haven't done as well remembering it lately, but for me it's made a big difference, and a positive one.
Thank you for listening to me too! <3 I believe in us! Good luck with everything and keep me updated!
@cloverisconfused
@Adam10999
It really is crazy, isn't it! Pretty much every time I hear something new from you I find myself going "what? I thought that was just me!" I'm glad I've been a help, even a little bit <3 I worried I was being overbearing or just spewing nonsense over and over again haha. I appreciate your words of support as well! You really are doing a great job at helping me stay motivated and comforted these past few days. Thank you!
I'm glad you've been able to make that realization! I'm sorry you're hard on yourself. You really do deserve better. I understand that mindset - I've also got some perfectionistic tendencies. Hopefully we can both remember that perfection is impossible, imperfection is good and healthy, and that it applies to us too - even if it doesn't feel like it. That's another thing I know but still have yet to feel. Good luck to you! And I wish overthinking was a job! I'd be anxious but at least I'd be rich haha
Aw thank you! I'm so happy to hear that. I find you give sound advice and it is so comforting to hear someone else in the same boat as me in terms of my struggles. I haven't listened to any episodes yet - I go back to work later this week, so I'll probably listen to one then. I'll be sure to send you a message!
That's good :) I'm sure you'll do great, just as you have been so far
Thank you! I've enjoyed listening to what you have to say as well. It's comforting and refreshing to talk to someone with such similar struggles. I wish you the best of luck as well, although I'm sure you don't need it!
P.S. A minor update! I still haven't contacted my Alice since Christmas. I'm planning on wishing her a happy new year (it's still not quite midnight where I am), but other than that there's been nothing. I know it's not very long but it does feel longer than it was. The update is that I haven't been so caught up in my head about the whole situation quite as much. I'm both happy and sad about it. I'm sure it's good for us both in the end, but it does play into those fears we were discussing earlier about losing meaning in my friendships. But, as they say, life goes on! I'll continue to keep you updated :) I look forward to hearing more from you!
@Adam10999 First of all, welcome to the community! It takes courage to open up about personal struggles, and it's commendable that you're seeking support here. Your feelings are valid, and it's understandable to feel hurt and confused in a friendship that feels one-sided. It's clear you've invested a lot of time and effort into maintaining this relationship, and it's okay to expect reciprocity and support from your friend. It's not selfish to prioritize your own emotional well-being and set boundaries in relationships. Confronting your friend about your feelings is a brave step, and it's important to communicate openly and honestly about your needs and concerns. Remember, you deserve to feel valued and respected in your friendships.
@Adam10999
oh no haha
Happy New Year! And yes, a hearty virtual cheers to that!
I appreciate that! I'll probably take you up on that. And the same goes for you! If you ever need motivation/comfort I'd be happy to help!
@cloverisconfused
@Adam10999 I understand that feeling. Like, I'm not exactly stuck, but I just kind of keep bouncing around between different bad mindsets, you know? Like I'm running around a track at the gym and I can go from the free weight section to the treadmills to the machines, but I can't leave the gym. It's a weird metaphor but I can't think of another way to put it right now lol
That sounds really difficult. Questioning your own intentions is very confusing and scary, too. I'm sorry you're having to deal with that. That username thing also sounds sucky - if I were you I think I'd feel hurt and also overthink it all. I'm glad you realized that even if you do like her, the long distance is not something you would want. Unfortunately, I don't have much advice to give about the romantic vs platonic feelings. To be honest, I can hardly remember the last time I had genuine romantic feelings for someone. I'm bisexual myself, but it's been so long since I've really liked someone. Even so, I find myself questioning what other people might think of my intentions. Since I can swing both ways, so to speak, pretty much anyone is technically on the table. I honestly just feel platonic affection for my friends, but part of me is afraid they'll think otherwise. That my affection (which I'll admit can be over the top sometimes, and I need to work on that) has something else behind it - something that would push them away. That's a part of why I'm afraid to talk to my Alice about how I'm feeling. I'm worried she'll think I like her and that it will make her uncomfortable. But if I stress that it's just platonic, it sounds like I'm just trying to cover it up, right? It's all just weird and complicated.
Good job making the list! I think, for me at least, that can be one of the harder steps to do because I overthink so much about what I really want and how I really feel. I also think those are some good goals to make, and I wish you luck!
I appreciate the update either way :) Plus, I'm kind of distancing myself from my Alice, so it's helpful. Technically, I could go see her sometime this week, but I find myself putting it off. For one, I'm still in that phase I was telling you about where all I want to do is just be alone and stay at home and watch movies or otherwise distract myself from how I'm feeling. And since my spring semester doesn't start until next week and I'm only working part time, this week might be my last chance for a few months to do really do that. I know it's probably not super healthy, but I'm having a hard time justifying doing anything else these past few days. Right now, my tentative plan is to contact Alice at the end of this week to set up a time to meet. Hopefully then I'll be able to muster up the courage to talk to her.
I think that's a really good way to put it. I'd heard people describe it as watching cars pass on a road. Your emotions are there, and they are happening, but they're going to keep making their way down that road, away from you. All you have to do is let it happen. If I'm being honest, I have no idea how well I do at that. To keep with the metaphor, I can't tell if I'm still having to work so hard at just observing these feelings because I've caused a roadblock, or if there are just a lot of "negative emotion cars" coming down the road lately. I hope that makes sense haha
I'm proud of you for trying to find something you can do alone and still have fun. I'm also glad you've found a friend that seems as invested as you are, although I totally understand the sadness. To be honest, I have sort of a similar thing going on. I mentioned in my initial post that I only have a couple of friends I'm really close to after high school. One of them is my Alice, and the other is a friend I'll call Sally. (also wow these are the most generic names lol) Sally really is wonderful and to be honest, she's the only friend I can think of who is so invested. I never have to worry about losing contact with her because if anything, she texts me more than I do her. She partly made me realize how little I was getting from all of my other friends, including Alice. I really am so grateful for her, and it's to the point where I kind of feel guilty. I feel so lonely and rejected by my Alice, and I wonder if I'm an Alice to Sally sometimes. I feel like such a hypocrite, and I feel almost greedy because I am lucky enough to have someone like her, but I just still don't feel good yet. It's so frustrating and confusing.
Thank you again for the update! I don't have a whole lot to update right now, because as I said, I've mostly just been at home alone, distracting myself these past few days. I'll let you know when I finally do contact my Alice. I appreciate you too, and I look forward to hearing more from you!
@cloverisconfused
@Adam10999
Haha thank you - both of the metaphors get more embarrassing every time I reread them so I appreciate you saying that😅And yeah, I don't think you're blowing it out of proportion. If it were the only complaint you had about your friendship with Alice, I might advise you to take a chill pill, you know lol? But it's not, it's part of a bigger problem and just so happens to be a fair example of your guys' dynamic right now. I don't think it's crazy for you to feel the way you do about it. Also, about the message revision - you might be entertained to hear I had to read that a couple of times before I figured out why you thought you were overthinking lol. It seems so normal to me to think that way. When I'm messaging people I tend to do the same thing. And to a degree I think it's only considerate to do your best to properly convey your tone like that, but when that mindset leaks into other formats of interaction like I believe it has it has for us both, I think it can pose a problem.
I'm the same - I generally do it in person when it comes up naturally, and always with a friendly/platonic tone. I've rewritten this paragraph specifically like ten times because I can't find the right words to describe why I'm so anxious about it, but I think you understand.
That's good - I'm glad you're taking that pressure off of yourself. And I like what you said about mistakes - they're meant to show us ways of improving, not to hold us back or tell us we aren't good enough. It's a good way to phrase it. I'll do my best to keep it in mind <3
Thank you, I really appreciate you saying that. I feel guilty every time I fall back into this, especially since there doesn't seem to be much rhyme or reason as to why I do, and I think I needed someone to say that to me outright. And thank you again for the offer - the same goes for you <3 Also, I could talk for a long time about the media I enjoy lol, so I'll try to keep it short. My favorite movie of all time is easily The Princess Bride, and if you haven't seen it you are missing out lol. I grew up on movies like Hook, Jumanji, Mary Poppins, Mrs. Doubtfire, Newsies, etc. so those will always have a special place in my heart. And I say movies in my earlier reply, but actually I've been watching a lot of tv shows. My Alice actually got me into kpop a few years ago, which accidentally lead down a kpop -> kdrama -> asian drama pipeline lol. I just binged a Korean show called Flower of Evil. It's pretty dark, which is not usually my style but it was so good. What about you, what do you enjoy watching?
Oh, good, I was worried it was kind of nonsense haha. I'm sorry you feel the same - it's such a frustrating thing. And yeah, forcing yourself to block out the feelings is different from observing them, but I haven't quite figured out the difference in practice yet. Maybe you're right, it's just a matter of suffering for a while until it's over, although I kind of hope you're wrong because that just plain sucks haha. Here's to us figuring it all out soon!!
I'm certain now that you have to be my long-lost twin lol - or maybe we're emotional clones haha! It's such a cliche thing to say, but I really thought I was the only one who thought like this. I'm glad you're enjoying the generic names! I'm sure you'll have more to look forward to lol. But thank you for saying all of that. It feels so nice to be so honest about my feelings and be met with kindness and understanding <3 and although there's probably always going to be a part of me that's stuck with impostor syndrome, it's a relief to hear someone say I'm not a horrible friend or person. I also hope you have someone in your corner because you deserve it too, and more. And if not, then I'll be here in your corner, cheering you on :)
P.S. Um, I just did the exact same thing lol. My condolences, good sir
Same here! It's been nice to come back here and hear more about your life, and then be able to be honest about mine as well. I hope to hear from you soon! Good luck with everything. (And about the names - we'll have to see lol. Maybe next we'll have a Tom. Or a Mary? Or we might as well just go with John Doe next. I named the last two so you vote haha 😉)
@cloverisconfusedNah, the metaphors are great lol, and if the username thing was my only complaint, I would definitely want you to tell me to chill haha!
@Adam10999
That totally makes sense. That is nice to have that reassurance. And I agree, quickly thinking about easy misinterpretations is okay, but any more than that is when it crosses from consideration to overthinking. And thanks lol
Good! If you do end up watching it you'll have to tell me what you think! If you don't mind my asking, why don't you remember much of your childhood? If you don't feel comfortable answering that's totally fine, I'm just a bit curious.
I enjoy modern movies too! They just don't come to mind first for some reason. My dad's family is also super into Marvel movies, and I actually just rewatched Captain America with my little sister a few days ago. And Dreamworks and Disney are also great! Megamind and How to Train Your Dragon are some of my favorite animated movies, and there are a lot of great Disney movies as well. I'm also not a big horror fan. My go-to Halloween movies are actually some of the ones you mentioned - Corpse Bride, Hocus Pocus, and I also enjoy watching Hotel Transylvania around that time of year. So yeah, definitely not big on horror lol. I haven't seen Children of the Corn, so I'll have to take your word on it haha. DC shows are fun! I'm not sure if we're talking about the same ones, but I did enjoy The Flash, Arrow, and Supergirl, although I haven't checked back in on them in a while. And Psych is such a fun show, I'm glad you mentioned it! I haven't seen the other ones you mentioned but I'll have to check them out sometime. As a general rule, I tend to lean towards fantasy/sci-fi so some of the other shows I enjoy are BBC's Merlin, Doctor Who, and Good Omens. And no way haha - that's so funny your friend also got you into kpop. I'm a fan of groups like Ateez, Seventeen, BOYNEXTDOOR, Dreamcatcher, LUCY, and Shinee, and I just finished watching Kingdom for the first time so I've been listening to a lot of BTOB, iKON, and The Boyz as well. And although I'm not super familiar with the groups you mentioned (besides a little bit of BTS), I do like the little I know about them! Unfortunately, besides a few songs from NF, I don't know any of the other artists you mentioned, including Starset, so maybe I'll have to give up the twin idea 😂 But I'll definitely check them out! Any particular songs you'd recommend? Some other artists I like, just off the top of my head, are Rachael Yamagata, Michael Jackson, Queen, Iam Tongi, AJR, Eric Nam, and Jeff Satur. As of late, my new go-to during times like these has been a korean-american artist called NIve, particularly the songs "Tired", "To: My Dear Friend", "Till u say i go", and "In My Head".
That's very true, and I'm very glad for your company. And I'm sorry that's happened to you so far - and although it's impossible to manifest bad things to happen, I totally understand the feeling. Sometimes overthinking can feel like having prophetic abilities, only you can only see the bad.
Oh, that's interesting! I was actually a rainbow baby, and if the other babies had made it I would have had triplets as older sisters. And thank you, you're so sweet! You are also one of the most sympathetic and accepting people I've had the pleasure of coming across. I've really appreciated hearing your viewpoints and experiences so far <3
Good haha. I'm so happy to hear you feel the same way. I really do want to hear your honest thoughts and opinions, so I'm glad you feel safe enough to share them. Thank you for being so great! (and yes, Hannah and Dan, I approve 👍Added to the queue 😉)
@cloverisconfused
Until next time madam!
@Adam10999
Oh, that's kind of a relief! I was a little bit expecting there to be some trauma or something, so for your sake I'm glad it's not that. Although I;ll admit potential brain damage is not anything to scoff at either haha 😂
That's cool! And oh my gosh I almost forgot Big Bang existed! I used to watch it with my mom when I was a young teenager but I haven't even thought about it in years. And I'm not much of a gamer myself but I am curious as to what video games you like
I'll definitely give those songs a try! Lmk what you think of my recommendations :)
I have two older stepsisters, an older stepbrother, a younger brother, and a younger half sister. Unfortunately we do not have the same birthday haha - mine's in January 😅 Ah, well, there's always the clone theory to go back to lol
<3 Same here! Until next time :D
@cloverisconfused
I'm going to be honest, I kind of wish I did have some trauma or brain damage, because then at least I would know what the problem was and already have sort of a solution, you know? 😂
I appreciate your curiosity and interest! My gaming list would probably consist of Warframe (3rd person hack and slash looter/shooter), Minecraft, Destiny 2 (just got into it a couple days ago but I am really enjoying it)(similar to Warframe and first person), Forza Horizon 5 (racing/driving), Fortnite, Satisfactory (survival factory builder), and GTA 5 (I used to make vehicles for modded storymode). Dead Island (zombie hack and slash) and Fallout New Vegas (open world post apocalyptic really good story) were my go-to games back in my Xbox 360 days (2014-2017). Valorant would have also made it on the list if my friends had ever asked me to join them. To be fair I did tell them that I don't enjoy it solo but I enjoy it with them, so maybe they would have felt bad inviting me to play something I don't personally find enjoyable, who knows. Oh, maybe some Bloons Tower Defense (6 currently, but I used to play 4 and 5 on my phone several years ago). I'm also currently working on a big project of making my own custom tower defense game, so that's been interesting but fun! More or less dove head first into that once I started this whole reformation/self-reimagining thing - probably as a way to distract myself until I could process what I was feeling.
And Happy almost Birthday!! 🥳🎉
I hope your birthday wish comes true, not matter what it is! And I also hope you continue to receive more and more gratitude and appreciation, because you truly deserve it!
From what I know so far, it sounds like you have at least a few people in your life that'll celebrate your birthday with you and make your day special - but if you find yourself unaccompanied for your day, if you'll have me, I would be honored to keep you company on such a momentous occasion!
Turned into Shakespeare or somebody there for a sec haha 😂 I do tend to have spurts where my inner thesaurus comes out lol
It would have been nice to have a twin lol - nevertheless, having an emotional clone is pretty sweet too <3
I wish you all the best!
@Adam10999
Haha I know, right? It would be nice to have something to point at and say "that's what's wrong with me!" - but oh well lol.
Those sound interesting! It's too bad your friends didn't invite you but I think you probably hit the nail on the head in saying they probably didn't want to pressure you into playing something you don't enjoy. And that project sounds so cool! It also sounds very complicated lol. I'm glad you've been having fun with it! I think it'll turn out well!
Aw thanks haha, you're so sweet! Happy very late birthday 🎉!! And I appreciate the poetic words, Mr. Shakespeare - you're so kind
Very true <3 I wish you all the best as well!
@cloverisconfused
I think we all have/had Alice at some point of pur lives.
Just wanted to say a few things
- Expecting respect in any relationship or friendship doesn't make you weak. It's a bare minimum.
- From what you wrote, it is one sided friendship.
- It's not okay for a friend to go days without responding. Yes, life happens and sometimes gets in the ways, but if that happens too often, it's a problem.
- You're not desperate or clingy for asking someone to explain why they stopped texting or whatever. You deserve to know.
@blueSpring7541
Thank you so much for saying this, I really do appreciate it. I'm not sure how much you read in my conversation with @Adam10999 but I have said again and again how validating it is to hear that I'm not crazy or weak or mean because I'm not happy with this friendship. I keep finding myself thinking about how it would be easier to just let this go and keep on letting myself be unhappy with this friendship, but anytime I get a response on this forum helps remind me why I'm not doing that anymore. Thank you <3
@cloverisconfused
I get it. We all get lonely sometimes or we miss good things about those friendships, or we hope they will change. I still miss certain parts of friendships that ended, but I no longer tolerate disrespect and gaslighting.
@blueSpring7541
That's good. I'm glad you've realized you don't deserve people that don't treat you right. Wish me luck in doing the same <3
@cloverisconfused
Just come here and read all replies whenever you have doubts! 🤞🏻🍀
@cloverisconfused
A third one here we come lol
Update: Spent the day with my best friend from college which was really nice. First time in a while that we've gotten to hang out without doing school work lol. We watched National Treasure and the new Hunger Games, and then played a board game. It was really nice!
Also, my Alice streamed for about an hour today, so I kind of got put to the ultimate test of my improvements. I conclude that I'm not nearly as ready as I thought I was, but I'm definitely a lot better than I was a week ago when all this started. She's streaming again tomorrow (not sure for how long) but I'm gonna go for round 2 and see how that goes. I'm also still in her *** server (haven't and am not going to check if I still have the really high tier role she gave me, not for a while yet) but I'm also still mod in her stream, so I'm both getting more practice with my emotions and having her back by helping give shout-outs and monitoring chat for rude or creepy people.
I've decided that whenever I do find myself ready to communicate with my friends again, that I want to reach out to my Alice (as I hope you have not lost hope or the courage to do so yourself <3 I'm rooting for you!) and ask to talk about things if she's up for it, or at least find out if we're still friends or on speaking terms. Definitely not that second part the way it's worded, because I don't want to assume that anything drastic has happened (cuz that would be me blowing it out of proportion, and that I need to chill out as she said) and also possibly thank her for incentivizing me to see how I treat others and myself, and giving me the motivation to work on that and become better - and also telling me some things that maybe were only bothering her a little bit, but that she pointed out to me from being upset. (I wanted to ask your opinion on thanking her though) I figure thanking her would definitely be part of a verbal conversation though, if we have it when the time comes. I also want to leave it open to if/when she wants to talk, and if she wants to speak or just message.
That's all I got for now. I plan on updating again after her stream tomorrow - if it runs overnight I'll update in the morning then. I hope all is going well with you, and I'm here if you need anything! <3
@Adam10999
That's awesome! I'm so glad you got to spend that time with a friend. Especially a college one, since I know we both have struggled to make good connections there so far.
I'm glad you feel like you improved - that has to be a relief to know it's getting better, even if it's not happening as fast as you thought. Let me know how round 2 goes. Good luck with that and the practice managing emotions!!
That's probably a good idea. And good on you for realizing you should wait until you're sure you're ready to communicate with your friends. As for advice, I'm not sure I could tell you anything you haven't already thought of lol. But I do think that thanking her is definitely going to be better as an in-person thing. I also think that it could go both ways in terms of whether it's a good idea. From what you've told me, it sounds like she was feeling a little bit smothered. I think that if you do decide to thank her, it would be a good idea to keep it on the casual side. Being too fervent about it could leave her feeling a little bit overwhelmed, if that makes any sense. And that's not to say that your gratitude itself is smothering or that you should necessarily stifle it, just that it might be good to keep her feelings in mind - it might help her feel freer to keep the conversation open in the future. But take my advice with a grain of salt! I'm no expert with this stuff, this is just what I think as a third party :)
I don't have a lot to update on right now. I was supposed to get dinner with a college friend last night to celebrate her graduation, but she canceled last minute. To be honest I was a bit relieved - I'm still not feeling super up to socializing. Besides a short few messages on Christmas and New Year's Day, I still haven't contacted my Alice, and I haven't been contacted by her. I told you, however, that I would contact her this weekend and set up a time to meet, so I am still planning on doing that. I'm really grateful, by the way - I 100% would have given up by now for the millionth time, but this forum is keeping me accountable.
On one hand, the more time that passes without her contacting me, the worse I feel about it. But that's when I think about it. On the other hand, the more time that passes without us interacting, the better I get about putting those feelings to the side and focusing on other things. I'm sure that I'm not doing as well as I think, but I know I'm at least making some process, which is good.
I listened to that podcast you recommended to me! I listened to 208: "Tough Conversations And How They Improve Your Mental Health" as it seemed relevant to my near future lol. It was really nice to listen to someone lay out the benefits of tough conversations out so plainly, and he gave really solid advice as to how to handle the conversation itself. One point that stuck with me was that it is a conversation, not a monologue about what you've been feeling. Another point I liked is that you need to go into it knowing what you want the solution to be. I've been going through different situations in my head for this conversation I'm going to have, and I didn't realize how many of them were like that - me having my little moment where I get to vent everything, and then with an unrealistic resolution where I feel 100% better afterwards and we suddenly have the healthiest friendship of all time. The fact is that if this conversation doesn't end the friendship, then it's going to end with me having more understanding to her reasons and her making the commitment to do better, not her somehow making up for everything that happened before. Either way, I'm not going to see results immediately. I can't expect to suddenly feel 100% better after the conversation, and I need to be okay with that.
Good luck with the stream! I'm cheering for you :D I'll keep an eye out for your update, and I'll update you when I contact my Alice. I'm here for you too! <3
@cloverisconfused
If you ever wanna learn about computers or get into gaming, you just have to let me know! And if it's the processing chip, then the keyboard's basically scrap... I appreciate your wishes for the best though!
I'm glad I was able to help, and I'm even more glad you were able to overcome your anxiety and send your text to her! I'm so proud of you!! <3 I'm also glad she got back to you so fast! I can only hope for the same when it's time for me to reach out for a conversation. I've never had boba before, but I really hope you two have the best conversation ever and both find your peace with everything! You really deserve it!
I agree that the "just about to text you", "missing you", and "makes it hard to reach out" seems almost gaslighty, but I do really hope it isn't! I'm glad she seems open to talk about it with you regardless though! You also shouldn't downplay anything you've been feeling, because it was very real to you and you shouldn't dismiss your emotions or else you're just gaslighting yourself. I know too well from experience. There's an episode towards the beginning on gaslighting, and I remember finishing it and saying "my brain literally gaslights me..." - it was such a groundbreaking realization for me, and I really don't want you to go through the same. Please be the kindest to yourself that you can be, because you truly deserve the world!
I'm sorry you're shaking, but I'm so glad you are able to have that release! I appreciate you keeping me updated, I really enjoy listening and helping you out wherever I can! You've been so supportive and sweet to me, and you've helped me out so so much - I really truly appreciate you so much!! You're nothing short of incredible!! <3 I will surely keep you posted with things on my end. Bye for now, wonderful friend!!
@Adam10999
I will! And jeez, that does suck. In that case, I really hope it's not the processing chip!
Thank you! You really were the final push I needed to get that done, so thank you :) I hope your Alice responds fast as well when the time comes! And you should try boba - it's definitely weird at first but it grows on you lol. Thank you! I really appreciate that <3
I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels like it's a little off! At least I'm not going crazy lol. It just doesn't quite match her history, you know? If she was more like that the rest of the time I wouldn't doubt it so much, but... maybe hearing that from me was a wake-up call? Or just plain gaslighty? I have no idea. But I guess I'll find out on Thursday. And I'll have to check that episode out! I'm pretty sure I also gaslight myself a lot of the time, so it'll be interesting to listen to. I'm sorry your brain gaslights you - that is not pleasant and makes it hard to trust yourself. Thank you! You also deserve the world, so be good yourself as well :)
Thank you so much! You are also just amazing! You're very helpful and kind, and incredibly thoughtful. I'm so grateful I was able to find you as a friend. I look forward to hearing updates from you, and I'll keep you updated as well! <3 Bye for now, and you have a great day!
@Adam10999
Hey! Just wanted to give a minor update. I've been thinking about thursday, and I'm having trouble figuring out what to say. It's like all my previous grievances are just... gone? Like, I still wish I got more from her. But I guess I'm finding more and more reasons it's because of my own insecurities and low self-esteem and clinginess.
I just don't even know what I would complain about anymore. I'm finding it hard to care, and I am embarrassed I even told her I wanted to talk in the first place because now I feel like Thursday is going to come and I'm not going to have anything to tell her. All I'll be able to say is that I've been lonely and feel like it's her fault when really I'm just sensitive and jealous.
Sure, she could have contacted me more or remembered to text me back. But the rest of it... was it really her fault? I'm becoming more and more convinced it was because I saw things (and honestly still do) through the lens of "anything that happens must be because I'm boring or annoying or something" so I felt hurt when nothing was intended, or perhaps even done. Maybe I have been relying on her too heavily these past years and now I've finally made a breakthrough. Maybe this is progress. Maybe the fact that I'm finding it harder to care is a good thing because I've emotionally distanced myself from her, effectively helping myself to stop relying on her.
I wish I could take my emotions and go back to about a month ago when I wrote the first post on this thread. I want to remember why I was so angry and sad. I just can't feel it right now for some reason. I don't know why. I just feel humiliated at the idea of having to explain to her how emotionally reliant on her I have been and how I don't know what to say now because it's stopped.
I wonder if it has to do with that cycle of depressive symptoms I told you about. The way I feel so lonely and sad and desperate then reclusive for a couple of weeks, then I feel fine for another couple of weeks. Maybe I was so hurt and everything because I was in that low point, but now that I'm "rational", so to speak, I can see that nothing was really wrong.
I'm worried it'll be one of two things:
1. It is actually because the friendship is one sided. But because I find it hard to care, I'll fail to fully express my thoughts, feelings, and boundaries in this conversation, which means it'll have been for nothing and I'll embarrass myself anyways. Then we're back at square one.
2. It's not one-sided, and I've been seeing it that way because of that crazy emotional cycle. I won't be able to come up with reasons as to why I've been feeling neglected because she didn't actually do much wrong, and it's mostly because I'm sensitive and emotionally reliant on her. I'll embarrass myself because I made a big deal out of nothing, and then in a couple of weeks I'll be back at square one when I inevitably come back to that point in the cycle.
I just don't know what to do. I don't know if I should trust the me that wrote that initial post or the me now that can't find a legit reason the friendship could be one-sided. And if the me that wrote that initial post isn't trustworthy and framed things in a biased way, then you won't have the right information to help me understand which one is right.
But maybe all of this is just overthinking. I just don't know where the line is between careful consideration and overthinking, you know?
Ugh. Anyways. Thanks for letting me rant <3 I hope you're doing well! Were you able to figure things out with your keyboard? I hope so 🤞You're wonderful, and I hope you're having a good day :)
@cloverisconfused
Hey! I appreciate the update and I'm here for you <3
It could be partly because of your thoughts, feelings, and emotions, but that doesn't change the fact that Alice hasn't been putting effort into your friendship. I think going over your initial post and our conversations might remind you of why you wanted to have this conversation with her, even though they've helped you become less emotionally reliant on her. Your feelings are still valid no matter what though <3 I think you're just in the stage of forgiving her for what she's done, but that doesn't mean the situation is any more your fault, and it doesn't change what you felt and that you felt that way for a reason. I think you're absolutely wonderful and I hope you show yourself the same kindness and compassion you have shown me and everyone you care about!
As for the conversation, it doesn't have to just be about what you currently feel, but should be about your entire journey of emotions, thoughts, and feelings over the past several months. Everything from you being extremely anxious about your friendship fading, to you becoming less emotionally attached. I would be open to improving your friendship with her, but let her know that it's going to take consistent effort on her part for you to do the same - if she stops putting in effort or just doesn't want to anymore, then that'll be that and you'll go your own separate ways.
Being less attached though, I get what you mean. I've become less emotionally reliant on my Alice too, and I think when the time comes to have my conversation I'll be in a similar situation of being like "you wanted me to be less emotionally reliant and now our friendship has little meaning to me. I gave you my time and effort but you didn't do the same. You didn't seem interested in staying friends, so I hope that's true because that's kind of how it's become" - which is sad because we wanted and put so much effort into making these friendships work, but our Alice's didn't reciprocate our efforts and now we're becoming okay with the outcome. Like, today marks a week since me saying I was sorry to hear about her loss, and this Thursday will be an entire month since we've had an actual conversation (aside from our dilemma 19 days ago) - but I'm also kind of okay with it being that long, so it hurts but doesn't hurt, you know?
I'm really sorry. I think you can kind of tell the moment part way through my response where my emotions changed and went into this state of non-caring too. Either that or it's because I took a break to fix my schedule for the start of the semester tomorrow, and that's really stressed me out. I share your cycle too though, and I also think that a mix of options 1 and 2 will be what mine is about. My Alice does have a lot of friends, and often times she would say she's best friends with people she hasn't talked to in quite a while. I don't know what to do either, but I think those who truly care about us will be understanding and compassionate through our difficult times - because no matter what we will have bad days and they will have bad days, but that's why we're here for one another, to provide love and support to make it through.
I always am interested in your thoughts and feelings, and what you have to say! Even just checking and seeing your username as a reply brightens my mood and makes everything a little better <3 As for the keyboard, I ordered some capacitors online that should come by the end of this week, then I just have to hope and pray that the capacitor is actually what's wrong with it, and not the processing chips. Until then I bought a keyboard for cheap from a friend, which'll hold me over until I can hopefully get mine fixed, of cough up the money to get another one when I can find a good deal. Changing up my class schedule has been really stressful though, I was on a waitlist for 3 out of my 4 classes, but I switched them up to only be 2nd in line for one of the classes and actually be enrolled in the other 3. This semester will only be 13 credit hours though instead of 17 like last semester, so I'll be able to actually get a part time job and make some money to help pay for school, and cover other expenses like car and computer mishaps lol. I would also actually like to start not being afraid to spend money on gifts or things I enjoy - that's always been really stressful for me.
I really hope your classes go smoothly, and that you're doing well! Thanks for listening to me rant about stuff too <3 You're so kind and such a great friend, Thank You! I can't wait to hear back from you soon!
@Adam10999
I am greatly saddened to hear that. I ask all those who read this to take a moment of silence in honor of this terrible tragedy 😔 (in all seriousness though, that does suck, I'm sorry. good luck with your next keyboard!)
I've been good! I've been really really busy, so I haven't had much time to myself lately, but overall can't really complain lol. I was actually just offered a paid internship of sorts, which is awesome! To be honest, I have no idea how I'm going to make time for it, but it's a really good opportunity that'll help start me on the career path I want to be on, so I'll make it work somehow. I haven't had the chance to make any new in-person friends this semester, but I have been able to see some of the people I do know already which is really nice!
I've missed talking to you too! It's so nice to come back online and see a new notification from you. But yeah, I definitely understand we've both been busy lol. Sometimes I get to the end of the day and realize I haven't even thought about anything besides my classes or work haha 😅 That's too bad about the class. I hate schedule changes, so to have been counting on it and it not work out does not sound fun. I hope it works out better next semester! I'm so glad you think you'll be able to get some part time work in - I know you were really hoping for that. That's cool about the group! I really hope you are able to make at least some casual friends there!
Thanks for checking in! It's so good to hear from you :) Keep me updated about everything and I'll talk to you again soon!
@cloverisconfused it's sad when things like this happens. I also had a similar situation recently last year with two friends who are a couple. After they no longer needed me their true colors showed up. My gut always felt like it was one sided and I thought that it was just insecurity. Now looking back I see how many times the took advantage of me and used my things without reciprocating. I also realized that they were manipulative and when I confronted them about the lies they were telling me they go so angry. I finally ended it but still feel bad how I did not do it much earlier when I felt it was not a good friendship. Now too much damage has been done to my trust that it will be difficult to repair or trust others. I just hope that you follow what your intuition tells you rather than wait for things to change.
@sympatheticOrange8782
First of all, I'm so sorry to hear that happened to you. That really is awful to feel used and then be treated like you're the one who did something wrong. I hope you can heal from that and remember that there are a lot of good people who would treat you well and can be trusted your faith in them. Thank you for replying and saying that as well - I'll do my best :) I hope you can too
Hey everybody! So I'm getting ready to have that conversation with my friend sometime soon. I've realized that when I invite her to spend time together, it would probably be wise to invite her to talk as well so she can be ready when I bring it up.
The problem is, I just can't seem to find the right wording to say it. I don't want to make her anxious wondering about what it might be or what she's done wrong, and I also don't know how to give her the basics without really going into it before the conversation. I just don't want to create that feeling you get when you were a kid and your parents go, "Hey, can we talk?" - that's too anxiety inducing and leaves you wondering what you did or if they're angry or sad or what in the world could be wrong. I want to make sure she can prepare, just like I will, so we can both be in the right headspace to have the conversation.
This is the best I could come up with, but I'm still not completely happy with it. One thing that sticks out to me is that "confused and sad" doesn't really do the situation justice, if that makes sense. If anyone can think of a different way to say it or any revisions I could make about any of it then I'd love to hear your opinions.
Would you have time to talk sometime? I've just been feeling a bit confused and sad about our friendship lately and I wanted to talk to you about it. You matter to me, and that's why I think it's important that we talk so I can understand your side of things.
Don't be afraid to tell me if you think there's something wrong with the way I'm saying it - I want to hear your criticisms. Thank you in advance! <3
Unsettled or unappreciated might also be good. For me it was hard to even have a talk as they blame me for feeling this way when I mentioned something is amiss. And if someone does not apologize or use things like "sorry you feel this way" or "you make me angry", they are probably gaslighting and manipulating you. I never knew these things until after I ended my friendship and reading articles on toxic friendships afterwards, I realized that it was going on for years which was why I always felt edgy while being around them.
@sympatheticOrange8782
I've been through exact same thing with a former friend. Gaslighting, manipulation, using me, crossing my boundaries, disrespecting me and my privacy... and so many other things. I heard things like
- you're overreacting
- I was just joking
- why are you always taking things so seriously
I'm sorry you've been through this but congrats on ending that friendship.♥️🍀🎉
@cloverisconfused
I think it's fine what you wrote as an example of your message to that friend. It's short, it says you want to talk about your feelings regarding your friendship, and you said you care about them.
I was gonna ask if you know what is assertive communication. Basically, it means talking about you and your feelings without attacking the other person.
Also, your friend's reaction will tell you if they are worthy of your time, effort and friendship. If they care, they will be open to talk about, they will value your feelings and will want to fix things.
@blueSpring7541
Thank you for the response! I appreciate your feedback about it :)
I haven't heard anyone describe assertive communication using those specific words, but I get the concept. It's actually is something I've been working at improving in for years now - specifically when interacting with my family. However, I very rarely get upset with my friends (and whether that is because things generally go smoothly or because I'm a bit of a doormat is up for debate, but that's for another time) so I haven't had much practice in that arena. Thank you for the reminder though - it's something I definitely need to be reminded of when I'm going into a tough conversation with a friend. Thank you <3
I'll definitely keep that in mind. Thank you :)
@cloverisconfused
So, I had to go back and read your problem once again cause I forgot the details. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the thing is:
- she doesn't respect you
- you feel unimportant cause she makes you feel this way, you're not crazy
- she texts you when she wants to brag about something, but goes weeks without replying when you reach out
- you're not her first choice when she wants to share good news, celebrate something
- she doesn't remember your birthday and she doesn't text you first for Christmas, new year's or any other holiday
Considering all of this, your message is too nice!😂
I'd go with something like
Hey, I know we didn't talk much lately, but there is something I'd like to talk about when you have time.
And then maybe something like (probably in person)
I feel like our friendship has been one sided lately. I understand if you are too busy or going through something, but when you don't text me back in weeks, I feel like I don't matter, like I'm only here when it's convenient for you. If you want to put some distance between us or to end friendship for good, please say so, I think I deserve respect and honesty after all these years we've known each other.
@blueSpring7541
I appreciate you going back to reread my situation and then give me more feedback! You didn't have to do that, so thank you :) And yeah, you've pretty much got it. She's not like this all of the time, but this is a good description for a fair amount of it.
Haha 😅 I can definitely see where you're coming from, and I really appreciate hearing your side of things. However, I'd like to introduce the problem to her before we actually talk in person so she can really prepare. Talking about "something" feels too ambiguous for what I'm going for here, if that makes sense. For this "invite text", I just need to figure out how to give her the basics of what my problem with her behavior is without going so deep into it that I might as well have just not asked if she was okay talking in the first place. I feel like I'm rambling, so does that make any sense?
I think that is pretty similar to what I'm planning on saying once we are actually face-to-face. Although none of this conversation is going to be easy, I know, I do think I'm more confident with what to say once we are about to really go into it. Again, I still feel like I'm not making much sense here, so let me know if I'm just talking nonsense lol
Thank you for the second response! I'm really grateful for your input, especially since you took the time to go back and reread so you can give better advice <3
@cloverisconfused
I think you're making sense, or at least I think I'm understanding you.
You could maybe use "uncertain" and "down" in place of "confused" and "sad", or say something along the lines of "I feel like we're becoming more distant, and that makes me uncertain about the longevity of our friendship going forward. If we could set aside some time to talk soon, I would really appreciate being able to communicate our feelings and understanding one another's perspectives." I hope that helps you find the right words.
I think it's a great "invite text" though, and I'm proud of you for sticking with it!
I wish you all the best!
@cloverisconfused
Sure, I understand you want to let her know in advance what's going on. Maybe just tell her
I'd like to talk about our friendship/communication lately. I've been feeling like it's one sided, but I'd rather discuss it in person when you have time.
I agree with Adam that you should avoid word "confused", cause there is no confusion there. It's pretty clear it's one sided and she's ignoring you.
Also, the fact that she is not like that ALL the time, is exactly what is the problem in toxic friendships and relationships! Of course people are nice sometimes, that is how they keep you hooked and invested! Have you heard of breadcrumbing in relationship? Google it!
@blueSpring7541
I like that. Thank you!
And yeah, that's a good point about "confused". I think that must have been why it felt off - I'm not really confused, just uncertain.
I have heard of breadcrumbing but I guess I haven't learned how to identify it! I didn't realize that was breadcrumbing. Thank you for helping me realize lol.
I hope things are going smoothly for you. Thanks for the advice!
Lovely
@cloverisconfused
I was able to keep my schedule at 3 days per week, but I had to swap out one of my classes that I wanted to take. I'm still on the waitlist for that one though, so hopefully a couple people will drop it and I'll be able to get in! Overall though I think this is going to be an easier semester than last. 17 credit hours AND a job is crazy, you're insane! Please don't overload yourself, and if it's too much for you to handle, there is absolutely no shame in dialing it back. I do wish you the best of luck with that though!
I will definitely start writing my feelings down like that too, I do that with most other stuff but just didn't think to do it in this scenario - Thank You! I'll always be here for you, and Thank You for always listening and providing the absolute best support! <3 Talk soon!
@Adam10999
That's too bad you had to swap classes, but I'm glad you were able to get your schedule to 3 days a week! I hope you can get into that one class 🤞And thank you - I appreciate it :) Honestly it's not too bad though - most of my classes are online which helps a lot. I'm definitely busy but it's manageable. I wish you luck with your stuff too!
Of course! Thank you for everything you do. Talk soon!
@Adam10999
So, it's Thursday, and... she canceled. It wasn't her fault, apparently she was saddled with babysitting her nephews (which she does a lot). Although I don't necessarily blame her I do feel frustrated, especially considering how I spent so much time today readying myself for the conversation.
But, what can you do lol. We rescheduled for next Thursday, so I'll update you then. How have you been?
@cloverisconfused
I'm really sorry to hear that. And to have prepared so well before hand too. I've got my fingers crossed for next Thursday, so hopefully nothing else will come up this time!
I've been doing alright. Mostly just organizing my school stuff, which I've almost got finished and will be working on tomorrow after class. Hopefully tomorrow my capacitors will get delivered and I can at least see if I can revive my keyboard - that would be so uplifting during this stressful first week of classes. Not having classes on Tuesday and Thursday is really nice though, I can catch up on sleep and still have the whole day to work on school work! I'm still on the waitlist for the class I want to get into... and the teacher said he's okay with it but I have to talk to the lady in charge, and all she said was that she can't skip over someone on the waitlist to add me. I thought about emailing back to see if she could push "first in the waitlist" into the class as well, but that's probably a useless attempt - my only hope is for 2 people to drop the class, which I don't see happening sadly.
I hope you've been doing well and your classes are going well too?! I appreciate the update as always, and I appreciate you as always <3 I look forward to talking with you soon!
@Adam10999
That sounds stressful, I'm sorry. That's too bad about the class - I feel like you had the drive to approach everyone you could to get into that class, and the people in front of you on the waitlist didn't. If the teacher is okay with it I don't see why you can't be added. Hopefully next time it'll all work out better. I hope your capacitors get delivered soon and that they properly revive your keyboard! I'm glad you're doing alright, but I hope you start feeling closer to good soon. Good luck, and keep up the good work! I look forward to talking to you too!
@cloverisconfused
I am saddened to share with you the news of my keyboard's passing. The capacitor transplant was unsuccessful in its revival.
Time to put the "fun" in funeral though! How are you doing? Anything new going on with your classes? How's the homework load so far? How is the friend making going this semester?
To answer all those questions myself - I'm doing good, missed talking to you for sure, but I know we've both been busy with school haha. Still second on the wait list for that one class and there doesn't seem to be anything I can do to get into the class. I figured out when all my assignments are due and made a calendar, so it looks like I'll definitely have room in my schedule to fit in some part time work! I got put into a group in my one class, so I'll be talking with them at least lol, otherwise I haven't talked to anyone.
I really hope you're doing amazing friend! <3 Talk soon!
@Adam10999
ummm I'm not sure what happened but somehow my reply for this was posted way above. I'm so sorry lol, I'll copy past and try again so you don't have to go searching haha
Here's what I meant to post here:
I am greatly saddened to hear that. I ask all those who read this to take a moment of silence in honor of this terrible tragedy 😔 (in all seriousness though, that does suck, I'm sorry. good luck with your next keyboard!)
I've been good! I've been really really busy, so I haven't had much time to myself lately, but overall can't really complain lol. I was actually just offered a paid internship of sorts, which is awesome! To be honest, I have no idea how I'm going to make time for it, but it's a really good opportunity that'll help start me on the career path I want to be on, so I'll make it work somehow. I haven't had the chance to make any new in-person friends this semester, but I have been able to see some of the people I do know already which is really nice!
I've missed talking to you too! It's so nice to come back online and see a new notification from you. But yeah, I definitely understand we've both been busy lol. Sometimes I get to the end of the day and realize I haven't even thought about anything besides my classes or work haha 😅 That's too bad about the class. I hate schedule changes, so to have been counting on it and it not work out does not sound fun. I hope it works out better next semester! I'm so glad you think you'll be able to get some part time work in - I know you were really hoping for that. That's cool about the group! I really hope you are able to make at least some casual friends there!
Thanks for checking in! It's so good to hear from you :) Keep me updated about everything and I'll talk to you again soon!
@cloverisconfused
That's so frustrating. I had same problem with my former friend when we were still friends. She would cancel last minute because her family asked her to do something for them. I did understand her, she couldn't set boundaries, but I was losing patience. Not having boundaries was her problem, but when it affected our friendship, then it became my problem too.
Good thing is you have prepared yourself for that meeting! I hope she won't cancel again.
@blueSpring7541
That's exactly it! Her inability to set boundaries with other people is the problem - maybe she hasn't done anything wrong, technically, but in the end it's making it harder to be friends with her. She's making avoiding conflict her priority instead of me, which is understandable, but hurtful. I'm sorry you've had to deal with that in the past.
I hope so too! I'll have to reprepare lol but I'm sure it'll be fine. It was good to hear from you!
@cloverisconfused
At some point, you realize it's okay to understand someone's behaviour, but at the same time you don't have to tolerate that. Lack of boundaries explains her behaviour, but it doesn't justify her disrespecting you!
@cloverisconfused
Hey! I wanted to wish you the best of luck with your conversation tomorrow! Just a suggestion that if you haven't talked with her since last Thursday, it might be a good idea to remind her of your meet-up tomorrow.
I truly hope it goes well and you both come to a conclusion that is best for you! Talk soon!
@Adam10999
Ah, you beat me to it lol. I was just about to post about something that happened today - she texted me to tell me all the reasons why she's acting the way she is. For one thing, she's saying she's too busy. Okay, fine, I can't really argue with that, although I'm also very busy and I'm still putting effort into this friendship. Apparently there's something that's been going on for a long time, but she's just realizing that there's a few grievances she has with me. Namely, that she hates physical touch so she wants me to give her personal space, she feels stressed out when I text her a lot, and that she doesn't like it when I take the Lord's name in vain. For context, I live in an area with a very high concentration of a certain religion - one I don't belong to but she does. It's one thing if she would tell me as these things came up. I get it, you know? But I've always asked her before I do/say any of those things if it's okay, and she's said yes. It's so embarrassing and frustrating.
I gave her my side of the story and I'm waiting for a response now. I don't think we'll meet up on Thursday - we might need to wait a bit before the tension dies down.
But anyways... How have you been? How's your semester going?
@cloverisconfused
I'm so sorry to hear about all that. All you can do is ask if it's okay before doing it, which you did - if she doesn't properly express that it bothered her, she can't get mad at you for doing what she said was okay. Physical touch is a bit weird since that doesn't have to do with texting... The busy excuse also kind of upsets me because it takes only a few seconds to even send "hi" and let someone know you're thinking of them and you care - I get only doing it once in a while and then sometimes having more lengthy convos, but still. It definitely seems frustrating and I agree some time will probably be needed - at least tomorrow during that time might be free for you now though. I hope she sees your side as respectfully as you have seen hers.
My semester's been alright so far I guess - classes are becoming more and more stressful and I might be reaching my tolerance limit of school with this being my my 10th semester overall (4 from my associates in Welding Technology from 2019, 4 from my associates in Computer Information Systems from 2023, and this is my second semester towards my bachelors in Computing and Information Technologies)
As for me, my hip hurts cuz I wiped out hard this morning on my icy deck right before leaving for class. Landed right on my side and it still hurts a little, but I'm surviving. Didn't break anything, so that's good.
Minor update that my Alice and I have had a couple single-responses to one another, and I'm still contemplating whether I should have a convo with her or not at some point. I also keep pushing it off lol.
Lovely chatting with you as always! <3 I look forward to hearing her response to your message! Chat later friend!
@Adam10999
Yeah, same. She said she'd get back to me after she got off of work, but that was almost 11 hours ago and I know she has eight hour shifts, so I'm not sure what the holdup is. But I'll leave it to her - it's out of my hands now.
Oh, boy that is quite a bit of school! I don't blame you at all for being tired. I'm sorry though - it's so frustrating when you want to just get things done but the exhaustion is setting in.
And I'm sorry about your hip! It's getting icy where I am too and boy, is it brutal. I hope it stops hurting soon!
I'm glad you've been able to talk a little bit. I don't blame you for procrastinating lol, it is a hard decision to make. Remember you deserve to treat yourself well, so do what's best for you - whatever that may be.
Yes, it's been great to hear from you! I look forward to hearing her response too 🤣 I'll update you when I get it. Bye for now! Be safe out there!
@cloverisconfused
Hey friend! I wanted to check in and see how you're doing?!
I hope the past few days have been amazing for you, and that you're remembering to take care of yourself - you absolutely deserve it! <3 Anything new and exciting happen the past few days?
On my end, my friend started doing a sub-a-thon on Twitch - to tease them I said that however many subs they get, that's how many nice things I'll type up and give to them haha! I fully mean it too, and they're up to 68 subs already haha!
Take care and I very much look forward to our next conversation! <3
@Adam10999
Thanks for checking in! I'm good overall, but my Alice still hasn't gotten back to me. I'm frustrated and hurt, but I'm doing my best to focus on other things and I think I'm doing a pretty good job! I decided that if she hasn't texted back by wednesday or thursday I'll contact her again. But until then it's in her hands. How have you been?
That's awesome! You're so sweet - I'm sure your friend will be really touched. Good luck with writing all of that! Congrats to your friend as well - 68 subs is a lot!!
You too!! I hope things are going well for you. Thanks again for checking in - it's so nice to be thought of! I look forward to talking with you more!
@cloverisconfused
It's completely understandable and okay to feel that way - she either doesn't know how to handle the situation/respond properly so she just isn't, or she's just not valuing your friendship like she should be - either way she isn't communicating that to you and that's on her. I'm glad you've been able to keep yourself busy and focused on other things, and I think that's very reasonable to give her about a week to respond on her own before following up.
Thank you for saying that! She still has about 7.5 hours left, and the timer goes up as she gets subs so I hope she gets a lot more! Crowwie_ is her Twitch handle, and you can tell her 'Scorchy' sent you haha.
Update on my end:
It's been 21 days since I offered my condolences for the loss of her family member, but last night my Alice messaged in her *** server to go wish a Happy Birthday to her friend who was streaming. I joined her friend's stream chat and said Happy Birthday, and my Alice was super excited to see me in chat. We only briefly exchanged greetings before I headed to bed, but the feeling of her being excited to see me was so uplifting - I feel like I'm floating on a cloud! I still would like to have a conversation with her, maybe this weekend, about our feelings of the situation, how we plan to communicate better in the future, as well as get some clarity on a couple things she's done that seem a little weird (like warning me about certain people's behavior towards her, who are in our friend's *** server, and asking me not to talk to them - yet our mutual friend still talks to them and she seems okay with it). I haven't figured out how I want to word my outreach to her yet, but those are the topics I want to cover in our talk.
I really appreciate all your kind words <3 I look forward to talking with you more too!
@Adam10999
Thanks for saying that. You always help me feel a little less crazy lol so I appreciate it <3
Of course! I don't have a twitch account but I'll be cheering for her in spirit lol
That's great! It's always such a nice feeling when someone is excited to interact with you, so I'm glad you got a bit of that with her. And yeah, I think a conversation is totally reasonable, especially for those things you mentioned that seem a little weird. I agree it doesn't seem quite right, so I'm proud of you for recognizing that! Good luck with that when you have that. Let me know how scheduling it goes and everything!
Talk to you later!! I look forward to it!!
@cloverisconfused
Hey friend! My week is over and onto the weekend wooh!
Sadly that weekend consists of a lot of homework lol
I figured out a few more things I want to do with my tower defense game and started implementing it yesterday! Still a really long way to go but it's coming together piece by piece.
I've been putting off figuring out what I want to say or how I want to word my request for communication, so that's going to be pushed off at least another week lol.
Always a pleasure m'lady, until next time! <3
@Adam10999
Hello!! Same here, FINALLY lol. I'm sorry you've got lots of homework 🙁 But that's so exciting about your game!!
That makes sense lol. I think it's a good idea to take whatever time you need :)
I sent another text to my Alice and finally got a response. We finally worked things out, and the end result is she needs to be better at communicating what she needs. We're going to take a month or so away from each other so she can work on that before we starting hanging out again.
And the pleasure is mutual - until next time!!
