Value of a Group Chatroom
A Group Chatroom at 7cups, I believe, has the motive of improving mental health, one way or the other. To serve that motive we have many chatroom discussions and events. We even have open-chat sessions where there is a host directing the talk to go in a specific direction. Those, I wholeheartedly believe, and could see, are having a good impact on participants' mental health. Those group chats have value.
But I have had a question, and I have been struggling to answer it. So I am asking here. What is the value of a group chatroom where people are just chatting casually? There are many different talks happening at the same time in the chatroom. It is like a classroom with no teacher and each bench is having their own chatter. What's more, this kind of chatter goes on for 24 hours. There are moderators to ensure no site rules are broken, but that does not prevent the noisy chatter from happening. The impact of such maddening chatter could only be toxic, negative, and dark.
Hope I was able to share my concern, and that you help me find an answer to my question.
@Fristo I have to admit when I first read this and got to the question of what the value of a group chat where people are just chatting casually I thought Ah! This is easy. My first guess would be companionship. But looking at it deeper, I can see that it could be seen as negative and dark. Especially if you're a newcomer. It could leave someone feeling left out. I think most of the people have formed friendships there so they just seem to group up and talk among themselves. It's probably easier for them to just keep a look out for each other's user names instead of trying to follow every line of conversation written? I imagine it's like a large party where there is a big group but people gravitate to people that they know and are familiar with. Some people are capable and comfortable doing that. I'm afraid I wouldn't be able to though because it would cause entirely too much anxiety and I would start to dissociate from the whole experience.
Hopefully someone has a more in-depth answer to this for you :)
@mytwistedsoul Unless there is an inclusive chatroom environment, where each newcomer is welcomed and valued, a healthy space cannot exist. But I hardly believe an inclusive environment is even possible if it is a just chatting chatroom 24X7. Without guided chatroom events, I hardly think people could get to know one another in a more meaningful and inclusive way.
@Fristo These are really good points you bring up. And I can only think of a few reasons. The first one that comes to mind is that maybe they don't want to know each other in a deeper more meaningful way? Another is maybe they've gotten to know one another already through forums or in guided chats. I have seen posts from other members in the past about how they feel unheard and left out of the chat rooms and in some cases that they feel there are favorites being played when it comes to the mods but I have no first hand experience with this myself. Maybe it's just how they prefer to fill up any lonely hours they have or it's simply a distraction for them?
@Fristo You ask a question and then follow it up with The impact of such maddening chatter could only be toxic, negative, and dark.
That comes across as rather all or nothing thinking and doesn't feel to me like you're really open to hearing the answer. I will share my answer anyway, I hope you are open to really listening.
How do you best get to know people? I know for me it wasn't in a classroom. Sometimes that's where I first met people, but the deeper relationships were formed elsewhere.
The group chatrooms can function in different ways. Sometimes it's like a birthday party, with a planned game.
Sometimes it's like an open house, people tend to be tied together in some way, some groups know each other. Sometimes 1 person only knows one or 2 people, a complete newcomer who just moved in next door might drop in. People naturally chat in groups, in pairs, introductions are made, a person may watch before deciding who to chat with. Sometimes it is an info session where people do want to learn about a specific topic. Sometimes it is closer to group therapy.
We have a member room entirely just for lighthearted chat, some wait for listeners, some just need a distraction in that moment, some may have some lighthearted social energy they need to express.
Even if I met with friends to discuss something serious, we will have lighthearted chatter too. It's important to have that for some relationships IMO. Heck even doctors I see on a regular basis chat for a bit with me.
I really like the guided discussions, but we will never hit all of the aspects someone needs support with either. There is lighthearted chatter, guided lighthearted chatter, serious open format chat, serious support in on open format and then serious discussions both information based and support based. You don't even seem to cover this various aspects in your post. I think talking to others about serious issues, especially when people have had similar experiences is incredibly therapeutic and is the main purpose I see for the topic based support rooms.
@AffyAvo I'd agree that all kinds of setups, from casual to serious, from informal to formal, play a part in bonding and feeling a sense of companionship. But 24X7 casual could not feel valuable to me, based on my observations and reflections. Going back to the classroom analogy, imagine a class where school hours are nothing but casual chatter. Need to mix up all to ensure it is meaningful and valuable and not just a wild and chaotic time-spending (and rather time-killing/escaping for many).
I could not feel value, maybe somebody else does, that's why the question.
@Fristo If you want to stick with the school analogy, ok.
The group chatrooms are like an independent study school. Some are only open during certain times and have set purposes during those times. Ie. We have information sessions and guided discussions. Others are free flow like open chats, some with a host and some without.
Then there are times people don't want to focus on any particular subject ie. they don't want to focus on a support topic. That is like a cafeteria, the foyer or other parts of a school.
Just because there is no host it doesn't mean topic based support isn't having. This is rather disrespectful to many here who greet,support, etc. without actually taking on a host role. Like a group of students reviewing class material together learning happens without a teacher present.
Having a social room open all the time - like a cafeteria or foyer - allows people a place to go so they aren't disrupting what's happening in classrooms. That is important too. The focus isn't always there, maybe someone needs to relax before a test. Maybe someone is waiting to be picked up for something serious unrelated to school and needs a distraction.
@AffyAvo For many members, only the cafeteria exists, because it is easy to be in the cafeteria all day long to distract oneself away from facing the struggles of life. Thus, in each room, there needs to be times it acts like a cafeteria, and certain hours it acts like a playground with organised sports/learning activities.
Howsoever we may choose to look at it, the ground reality exists that toxic chatrooms exist at 7cups (not naming them, but those who visit know), and they've been in dire need of our reflections and corrections.
@Fristo The same is true with the independent study schools, some students never graduate as they do not do the work. That doesn't mean you should take away a lighthearted place for people to be. This site is used by people 24/7. While waiting to chat with a listener having a place to just hangout can be nice. Or sometimes people like the support they get in a room, but a guided discussion topic doesn't apply to them and they just want a place to be for that moment. Some people are doing the really hard therapy elsewhere and need something lighthearted. Kicking all of the students off of campus if they aren't studying in a particular moment isn't healthy nor a good way to support them.
I don't think I have ever seen a room on 7cups that is completely toxic. I have seen rooms be toxic at times and some rooms experience it more than others. I think that issue needs to be dealt with, simply deleting the room or forcing it into something else just pushes the people who are creating an unhealthy environment into a different room.
Yes the member community room is a very toxic room full of the same unwelcoming members who actually enjoy bullying newcomers and I have seen moderators sit and watch whilst doing absolutely nothing to discipline..
@Fristo This is such a great question... For me, I think that group chatrooms can be a lot for some, such as constant new messages coming in from all angles, the awkward tension between members where drama can unfold, and moments when no one is online, and you just want to talk... However, I do believe that there are aspects that make group chats valuable... I think some valuable points can be made:
- You are never alone - having a chatroom where you can release and talk about anything and everything (while of course being monitored to ensure rules aren't being broken). I can understand the craving for conversation for some that don't have people around them that they can casually chat with, and online group chats can be helpful in this case.
- Entertainment - Many people use chatting as a proactive activity to do something new, simply talking to others is one that many people overlook. If you're having a bad day, or you just want to steer from your thoughts and talk to others, it might be a way to keep yourself occupied.
- Form of Therapy - Therapists do not come at a cheap price... so chat rooms can provide a great benefit to people in such a situation. Nobody knows who you are, your name, etc, and it's not something that many people care about because ultimately, people just want to chat.
Now for the disadvantages...
There are some downsides to this, such as not getting to know each other much because the chatrooms can be chaotic or noisy, and chatting with so many different personas in such a short amount of time can have a negative impact and become overwhelming for some. Members also don't have the chance to message each other, so the chatrooms are the only place where they feel "connected" aside from a 1-1 with a listener.
The other downside is as a newcomer, they are unfamiliar with the site, and how it works, and the chatroom could be too much. I think that perhaps a dedicated chat for newcomers to welcome each other and talk could be helpful, so to put it in perspective, any new member that joins could be offered a badge that can unlock that group chat specifically until a certain amount of time before joining other support rooms?
@Fristo to add onto the above, I think that hosting guided discussions in the chatrooms can also be a way to bring members together and get to know each other. This also takes away from some of the chaos and allows members to focus on a positive guided discussion, and open room for positive conversations amongst each other.
@JujuBears Right Juju, the effect of a positivity event is lasting beyond the event. One could see improvement in the quality of casual chats as the result of positivity events happening in the room every day.
A challenge here is, that people who are used to casual chat format, unhappily happy with the darkness, won't welcome guided discussions at first.
So what we can do is, read the room and informally look to host a few questions and activities. I have trialled this and have tasted success too. Many came to appreciate the questions and demanded more. Some participated in the activities I gave them. The interest develops gradually, and once it does, the nature of the room starts to shift toward positive and uplifting.
@Fristo Alsooooo, I feel that as more compassionate people participate and provide support in the room, more accepting the participants become of these compassionate people (those good at empathy and in the room with the intent of providing support), the further it becomes easy to introduce positivity questions and activities!
@Fristo
I wasn't going to comment here but now I feel it's important to. I appreciate the sentiment and where this is coming from, you want the chatroom to become a ‘better positive influence’ and for people to ‘not dwell on the negativity’, moreso not allow a 7 Cups resource to fuel that.
But honestly, this feels forced. It seems you expect for people to act a certain way in the chatroom. And it is not that people are unkind or anything as such, in general, according to me.
You did a 4 hour long session as I noticed upon entering today and I see many people enjoyed it and many didn't. You say 24*7 like it's something on the problematic side of things for you, I don't think so. Well there are other 24*7 support rooms and also those for fun sessions which can be opened anytime. It is good to be mindful of time we spend in there, but I would also appreciate if it's not forced to be prompted to respond in certain manners. I don't want to talk about my issues or do the deep talk and that chatroom helps me just be, I can post lyrics of songs and just heart messages and bond with people. When it's guided, I have to think the direction the script or questions or hosts want me to. I do not want that. Prompts are fine but they are often rhetoric on purpose as you may be aware. Don't like to say this but it feels like room and thought policing.
Good to have a change once in a while which might also be necessary or helpful, but so much so that the purpose of the room shifts? Maybe not. People are seemingly allowed to have conversations ‘in the background’ which is nice but maybe sets a particular group of people aside just because they do not want to engage in the questions and it is awkward. I hope you can recognise the diversity of experiences and all the walks of life people come from, this does not work for me.
Something better to do, I would say, would be to share something to help direct the conversation forward once in a while randomly, *not with the aim to make people think a certain way and then be rewarded for doing that* however, at least not in these non structured rooms. I have so much to say but I don't know how to right now. I know you mean well. <3
@ourchemicalhearts I do mean well! I just want to see room to be of a positive nature, but have not been able to figure out how, and thus have been thinking and trying different things. Sorry that my thoughts felt forced, or if anything I tried to do felt forced. I've been sad since long to see some people are unhealthily attached to the room (I'd happily be wrong) and it's been so for years.
I do see the concern, fristo. And I know you mean well. You imagine a room that is healing and therapeutic for anyone who enters the room and spends some time there. You want each one to feel loved, and for that, you wanted to inspire a more positive environment there.
I agree that positivity events could be a great help in achieving that. I want you to know I value you for your intent and admire you for your efforts despite it being not an easy path.
With that said, any change is gradual and requires your patience. You can't just do too much too soon and expect the change to be accepted. Do little, and little more, and then little more. Little little adds to lot, and over time, leads to remarkable advancements. Give them a chance to get to know you and your pure heart more and see the effect this would produce.
Hope I helped. Sending lots of love.
Hello all,
Chiming in with agreement: I believe most different types of group chats, whether it's serious, focused discussions, directed/scripted activities, or just mindless socializing, all have a purpose and all have a place- it's just a matter of what a person wants/needs in the moment.
Now being new on the site, I'm rather confused as to where these group chats actually take place, but I'm trying to learn. I thought that each Community forum had its own, dedicated chatroom open 24/7, but that appears not to be the case, and you also apparently can't connect to other members by messaging them (which- why is that anyway?), so hopefully I can figure out how this all works.
Wishing the best to everyone!
Hey @AmazedAgaric, welcome to the community. I like what you said about different spaces having a purpose, I see it the same way.
I get it's hard to navigate around specially when new, the site is huuuge haha and there's lots to do and explore, take your time please.
Most sub-communities, if not all, do have a dedicated topic-focused chatroom, however yes you're right, they aren't open 24*7, some are Rotational Rooms (opening on certain day of the week only), others are pop-up rooms (opening only during the time of a session/ discussion taking place in the presence of a chatroom leader/ host in the room). Also here's a recent post made on some scheduled sessions.
Some chatrooms also need to be unlocked, after meeting a few requirements, you can find them Here.
The Community Guidelines too is a great place to start with, to familiarize more with the community, and have some common questions answered.
(Text in blue is clickable)
I get this is a lot of information hehe, and it is again not comfortable navigating through so much at once, I'm super proud of you for willing to try and doing your best in figuring things out. Asking questions and reaching out to others for help and assistance is certainly a great way to get going.
I hope this makes things a bit more clear. Feel free to let us know if there's anything else we can help with. ❤
Best wishes to you also!
Regarding the "Why can't members talk to each other via personal chats?", to begin with, I'd like to assure you that you're not alone in questioning this, time and again many have raised queries about the same and understandably so. Here are some usual-provided responses summarized-
♡ Lack of means to monitor anonymity and safety in a 1-1 chat involving two members.
Now one would ask, what makes it different than the conversations involving a listener and a member, and rightfully so. With listeners though, they are expected to remain professional and have stricter guidelines to follow, violating such could lead to some consequences too.
I personally like this answer by a former mentor leader (I'm unsure what exact role they had, but nevertheless, it is a well-explained one for me), of our site in one of the old threads where someone else raised a similar question. Quoting from this post, " Members are not allowed to PM each others because (due to the nature of the site being anonymous conversations) we do not have the means to monitor conversations and ensure these conversations are appropriate. For listeners, we have a series of things to promote and ensure quality as anonymous evaluations, member reviews, member reports, coaching emails, censoring...but we do not interfeer directly on what happens on a 1-on-1 to protect and ensure confidenciality. Also, listeners receive training and guidance on how to appropriately handle chats, and if they do not follow the rules of engagements or need to develop their skills, steps are able to be taken....right now we do not have this option with members. We cannot ensure member conversation would remain appropriate and keep them at the same time anonymous (at least not at this point)."
♡ Members can however connect/ talk via forums and group chats.
Having said that, feedback and suggestions are always welcomed by the community. Please feel welcome to submit one using this form, anytime. ❤
Also tagging @ASilentObserver to add their thoughts, if any!
@Sunisshiningandsoareyou
Thank you for the information and clarification- I appreciate it!
I definitely see the reasoning behind the 'no PM' rule, but I do think adult members should maybe be given the option to opt in (or out) as they choose. I've always found that making meaningful personal connections is a great part of learning and growth as a person, and of achieving balance and emotional wellbeing, and since helping people do that is a goal of the site it seems like, I don't know, it's lacking part of process?
I'm new here though, so I don't pretend to know best; it's just my personal preference/perspective.
@AmazedAgaric
You are very welcome!
Aw yes indeed, I agree with you about the impact meaningful relationships can have on our wellbeing, the ability and means to connect with others, brownie points if they are in the same boat as us; makes the whole idea of "supporting is a two-way street" come into action too, I see why you think so as well.
We are all entitled to have our own perspective and opinion on things, I feel a variety of thoughts have the means to create magic hehe, one person *cannot* know it all or do it all, it takes many ideas, suggestions, feedback, encouraging comments and patience (lots of it haha) to build something and then to continually keep working on improving it for the best. So again, I see value in your thoughts and I do encourage you to share it with those that have a mighty say in making things happen around here, the feedback/ suggestions form I shared above being one way to reach them. ❤
@Fristo
I retained this post and this one, which were deleted previously.
Please see Communicating Forum Post Deletions
@Fristo Thanks for sharing this with us.
I really enjoyed reading this.
