How do I dig myself out of this mess?
Hello,
not sure if depression is the right place because there seem to be many issues. What I need right now is practical help/advice, like steps I can do, and how to do them.
Let me first say that I'm pretty ashamed about my situation as it is right now, and I have absolutely nowhere to turn to for support.
My problem is that I have crippling self-esteem issues that make it hard to do just anything. Partially because I am downright scared of everything I gotta do, partially because of weird beliefs I can not seem to get rid of. Even how the whole world works scares me. Like people taking it so granted they have jobs and money and all.
I finished my studies last year and since then have been unemployed. I kept telling my dad who supports me financially that nobody replied to my applications but actually I did not apply for a job yet because I don't think anyone will hire me anyway. Sure, I could get some random side job, but I don't think anyone would hire me in the field I have studied and give me money for what I do.
Then I see all of those successful young people who found businesses and sell them and make money and blogs and travel and I wonder why it works for them but I can't even imagine it. In self-help books about entrepreneurs for example it seems like the world has certain rules and everybody can apply them, but how?? Why can't I? I see them sit in the cafe with their fancy MacBooks, being busy and working on stuff. I don't even understand most of the job offers I find, but they have to do with Google Analytics, AdWords, optimizing search results - is this what I have to be able to do if I want to be successful? Is it bad that I also think it's bullshit because I hate when I google something and find a website that has nothing to do with what I'm looking for or only has generic ghostwriter content because someone pushed it up in the search results?
It feels like there is this well and everybody can drink from it only I can't.
Additionally I am in this place where I absolutely do not want to be. I live in a small city apartment, it's loud, car fumes, people everywhere. I feel constantly stressed, pressured, like a loser, and have no idea where to start to get out of here. I need money so badly but don't dare to apply for anything.
I lie awake at night, wondering where I could go so wrong. I wanted to work with animals, I never wanted to live in this city, I never wanted to end up here like this. I want to live in a quiet place that feels like a real home with real people where I feel appreciated and loved. Here the only "friends" I have are a few fellow students who are as lost and hopeless as I am, and together we dwell, but recently I cut myself loose from this because I got so tired of it. It never gets me anywhere, it's not even fun.
My dad does support me financially, but not emotionally. He lives a few hundred km away and I hardly talk to him. He can't give advice or even understand me, he usually just comes up with some calendar wisdom whenever I try to squeeze anything helpful out of him. Gave up on this. He never was emotionally supportive, he was always distant, at least he now supports my inability to live. Thanks, dad!
My mom is something like dead. So there is not really anyone I could turn to for help, but that's not new. They already abandoned me when I was a child, I've always been alone. Now what pains me is that I am unable to dig myself out of my situation because I lack the strength and courage to do things. I don't trust people, I hardly go out, I never engage with strangers much. I used to think I hate people and their bollocks, but actually I just feel terribly insecure dealing with them. Sometimes I wonder why I am so stuck up in general and never dare to do anything. I mean, if nothing really matters and my whole life is a pile of shit, I can as well just sell everything, take my backpack and go somewhere else. Or just kill myself. Or go at least sky diving. But I never do anything because I'm too scared and cautious to ruin my "future". I never do spontaneous things, even going for grocery shopping is a challenge because I constantly feel judged by everybody.
It's like I can never feel at home, right now I don't even have a home, never relax, and to ever even have hope of ever being in a place where I can relax, I have to do things that require inhuman strength, I simply have no idea how to do it. And it angers me so much because I know it's theoretically pretty easy and possible, and that I'm not actually incapable of it.
I don't think posting this thread will actually help me either but hey, if you have nothing to lose it's always winning, right?
@ITeleportBread
Hello, and welcome! It sounds like you're far from where you want to be in your life - you're feeling frustrated, disconnected, and not true to yourself. The good news is that you've found this place, are reaching out for support, and are willing to work on improving your situation. If you look around here, you'll find many helpful resources. Which ones you should start with depends on where you identify your biggest issues, and on your personal preferences. You've already found the forum and might have browsed around for others' experiences and useful links. Have you had a look at the Mindfulness exercises and other audios, and the self-help guides? I don't think I could give you much 1-on-1 support as a listener at this point, but if you can work independently and are just in need of more guidance on how to go about it, you're welcome to message me.
@ITeleportBread
Hi TeleportBread, You have lots of stuff going on, but everything you mentioned is quite fixable. I'll throw out a few potential fixes and you can pick and choose.., or not.
Self Esteem? - Totally fixable. Consider a evidenced based CBT resource (esp. David Burns) Depression too, if you suffer.
Whats next? You have limitless chooses but you really need to know what you want. Once you know what you want it fairly easy to drive yourself in that direction with goals etc. Consider William Glasser's easy reads on Reality Therapy and choices.
But what if you don't know what you want? Positive Psychology is the emerging field of happiness, contentment, well being. What does science say about what actions we can take to move this way.
Get out of the city? Farmers.com if you are a female in the USA. JUST KIDDING!!!
Bread, you certainly have the tools to have a great life (intellegent, educations, and you have limitless choices and potential). Decide what you want and you will be on your way to an exciting journey. I'll be cheering for you!
and free Myers-Briggs online personality test if you don't know yourself OR if you want clues as to which careers are the best fit for you
@WGlasser I'm INTP but I don't want to be an architect, dreamy professor or philosopher, I want to overcome my social issues and the roadblocks in my thinking, make money with what I am good at, and be happy.
Let me quote a website: " INTP personalities are so prone to reassessing their own thoughts and theories, worrying that theyve missed some critical piece of the puzzle, that they can stagnate, lost in an intangible world where their thoughts are never truly applied. Overcoming this self-doubt stands as the greatest challenge INTPs are likely to face"
@ITeleportBread
Hi Bread, I don't know you except from your posts, but the quote you posted sounds like you. Agree? INTPs are interesting I found some other info on INTPs that matched up with some of your recent concerns. Don't know if you had previous Myers-Briggs exposure or not. If not, can be quite helpfull for insight and direction. (eg strengths, potential weaknesses, etc.)
So Einstein and Lincoln were INTPs. You're in good company there.
@WGlasser
Thanks for the recommendations. I'll definitely check them out!
So about what you say, I have the tools - maybe. But I don't know how to use them, and I lack the ability to come up with practical steps. For example if I now decided I wanna work with animals - I don't have any experience with this. Nobody will hire me. And I would have no idea where exactly to go or how to approach the situation to convince someone into hiring me. I couldn't even convince someone to let me take their dog for a walk.
I considered talking through this with people to actually come up with ideas, I really like tackling problems actually. But I don't have anyone, only sarcastic, cynical people *cough* who try to nip every enthusiastic approach like: "HEY! Help me find 10 ways to do/get xyz" in the bud as early as possible with sneery comments. There is nobody really open-minded.
Considered coaching, but I don't have the money. Guess books will have to do, also I found a self-help group that sounds like a perfect fit, gonna try this out.
Well. And even if I come up with ideas for how to improve a situation, let's say I try to make contacts with farmers or people who work with animals, like in a zoo or at the vet, it would still fail on me in the end. Because then I gotta go out and achieve the thing, and I don't feel capable of this. I can't even network in the area I've studied, I feel like a total loser, I lurk in the background and then quickly go home before anyone notices me.
But as I said, that self-help group even tackles this. Really hope this is gonna be good.
Hi @ITeleportBread,
I'm sorry you're going through bad times. But somehow I can feel some wise and positive side of you piercing through your description of all your tough issues.
Don't be ashamed, dear, the struggle is always real and really serious. But it's good that you're reaching out and realising some of the things that you need/want. Really good, that is a start.
I can relate to self-esteem issues and this feeling which sounds like anxiety to me. It's so tough to change, and it doesn't happen overnight. But it can, when you learn to appreciate your deeds and criticise yourself less. I can say that self-esteem issues are a killer and it's definitely hard to spend the whole time with your own self when you have a bent view of your image. But you're the only person whom you'll lave to live with entirely till the end of time, so it's nice to give something a go. I bet you can think of your three virtues now.
You graduated from university, that's so great! Isn't that an accomplishment? For me, it is. I'm still on my winding path towards graduation.
As for money and all that, I guess one thing is hip now and tomorrow it might well be knocked from the pedestal. What I mean is, job market is a wicked place where flexibility and adaptivity count. Oftentimes, when you look at many people you described, you're likely to see them professionally burnt out in a couple of years. In my view, carving out your own niche is vital to self-fulfillment and your own success. And you mentioned that you know what you'd like to do. (And don't worry, many people nowadays work in some other field that they specialise in university-wise.) Seems like you're worried about the lack of experience. Would you consider some voluntary work, even part-time? Many employers look favorably at people who have some voluntary work records in their CV. Dog shelters/charities come to my mind. Also, being among animals is somewhat therapeutic. How about that?
I'm sorry you don't feel any support, either... But you're on the right track, as you got here on 7cups. There are many people here who are willing to talk to you (listeners, forum users), and I hope using this site will give you some motivation and a slightly other perspective to look at your issues. (You could check this out: https://www.7cups.com/exercises/mindfulness/?showlist=1 )
I'd suggest you to reach out for a professional, though. Don't be afraid or ashamed. I'm aware that financial issues are often an obstacle, but there have to be some counsellors or some other kind of specialists who could see you free of charge. You could check online or use some Facebook groups to find out.
I can relate to your anger, and anxiety and hopelessness. But please do think of yourself kindly and maybe consider thinking about yourself as a good friend.
I hope my post brings you a bit of relief and support.
I wish you all the strength and love, you deserve it.
@greenEyes2019
Hello greenEyes,
thanks for your long and well-thought-out response!
Maybe I was not as lost as it felt. Do you know how it is when you are in a wave trough? You are near the ship/boat, maybe even near a beach, but the moment the waves are high around you, you can't see any of this. All you see is water all around you. Maybe this is what happened.
Considering that I am trying to consciously (that's the key word) to find my way through this life for quite a while now and made conscious decisions to study (my dream subject btw), keep studying through hard times, keep going, and so on, I should maybe have had more trust that I could not get completely lost anyway because in some way it must have been connected to me and my personality, otherwise I would not have went through with it, right?
So I listened to this TED talk a few nights ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfNX1cHk-fE
And it was eye-opening! I have read so many books and listened to so many motivational speakers that I don't expect anything new anymore, even though I know different topics resonate with you at different times, depending where you stand.
There Laura Berman says that you, like an egg, consist of a yolk and a shell, and the career and the outside circumstances are the shell, but the yolk is what makes you as a person. Yeah yeah, I know this. I know you are not your career, you are not the contents your wallet, you are not your f*cking khakis.
But what she says at 5:10 is what makes the talk so good. If you look at the choices you made so far, and check them for the "yolk", even if they look like totally out of place, they might still make perfect sense according to your personality.
This means there is not only ONE way to work on what is important to you. I love animals, but I don't need to work on a farm 24/7 to help animals, I would not be good at this and I would not like it anyway. Instead I can work with what I have and from where I am and still do something that is aligned with what is important to me.
When I ask myself what I would like to do if I could do anything, I would not want to live on a farm and work with animals fulltime. That's a relief. I still would want to do roughly what I am doing now. So I am not entirely lost!
I read a few books on the topic of finding what you want to do with your life, and I was really always struggling with this. The book suggested that you look at your childhood and how you would help your family with the knowledge you have today, and this is your reason to live, but this did not help me at all. I got closer to what might be my purpose but it was still too vague, it did not motivate or even move me. Still something was brooding, ignited by this thought process.
And last night, I guess I finally found it. I found the one thing that connects what I have always done, already as child, always liked to do, and what I am really good at. What people have praised me for all my life. I did not see it because it's a bit diffuse and quite specific at the same time. Now it all makes so much more sense. I remember being with an ex in a restaurant and talking about this very thing, but it was absolutely unrelated to my studies or anything in my life, for me it was a fantasy, a fun thought, but he looked at me in awe and said: Wow. Your eyes just lit up and you looked so happy talking about this.
This thing is aligned with what moves me, what motivates me, what I care for, what I am, what I wanna do, and what might be my mission in life. I just never considered it because I could not fit the pieces together, it was before my eyes but I could not see it. I know all of this sounds super cliche but this is how it is.
Shortly before easter a few job offers came out in the area I studied in and I did not want to apply (still don't want to) because the jobs are so boring. It is what I studied and related to it, but still I found 1000 reasons to not apply, and I won't. I would hate the job. I had all this noise in my head from fellow students: "This is how the jobs are, this is what you gonna do, you can't choose"
Well, that's THEIR belief. That's what they think life is. Only because THEY got rejected doesn't mean I will get rejected. They did not make what I did, they are not good at what I am good at, they do not have what is in my head and what is my vision and what I care for.
You know, all the time during studies I tried to fit in and to pretend and there were all those rigid categories...this is this area, and this is that field, it has clear borders, and you either do this or you do this, and if you wanna be good at that, you also gotta learn that, blabla, and care for this area.
I just found myself not interested in many of these things but I did not get why, so I pretended to be. And this is a reason why I also did not want to apply (even though impostor syndrome is another very common thing that happens also to people who know what they want): I felt that a possible employer will immediately see through me. That I am pretending, but that I don't really care.
I also realized by helping a fellow student with his thesis, that what is my thing and my strength is not something everybody can do. This student is someone who holds standards and gatekeepers high, something I was especially intimidated by. There are those incredibly good people, I can never compete with them anyway, and he praises them and tries to become like them. It feels so wrong. And still I realized while working with him that I do have an edge over him and can't even properly explain to him what it is or how he does it, it's just how it is. How we are. Our minds just work differently, and what he despises, can do or can not do, has nothing to do with me. I don't need to be like him.
These incredibly good people followed their vision and it worked for them, I'm sure if they had just followed instructions or pretended to care they would have not been successful, because pretending to care burns out.
So, very long story short, I now have a much better idea of how to apply and what exactly to apply for, and I also decided to not be intimidated by all the possible employers out there. Even looking them up is a bit hard for me, but not so much anymore when I leave all this pretending bs out of there and focus on what I really have to offer and where I would really fit in.
I decided to see the companies I'm going to apply for as a plate full of chocolates :D
I also now feel more willing to stand up for my interests, because something I thought was a time waste and leisure I can not afford is an important ingredient for what I wanna do. I always wanted to do it but I found excuses to not do it because I should sit on my ass and work. Also it was seemingly not related. Now I know why it might be important for me and why I have the strong urge to do it.
Now I only gotta find a way to overcome my social anxiety, haha.
I found a self help group that looks promising, but now I don't know if I gotta go there anymore because it's work issue related and with my current epiphany I am not sure if I can identify that much with the group anymore. It seemed like the perfect fit, but now I should probably rather go and find a social anxiety group.
Thanks for your help again and all the good wishes. I'm trying to be a good friend and take responsibility for myself, but sometimes it's just hard to be alone and on my own all the time, and simultaneously knowing that nobody else can help me either, even though that's also a kind of relief because it means I'm in charge. I guess.
Have a great day!
@ITeleportBread
Your ship/boat metaphor reminded me of the short clip included here: https://www.7cups.com/act-therapy-techniques/ And the situation you mentioned might be horrible. Some people can't see anything but water around them. Some people see their demons only.
Consciousness is vital, I'm glad you're somehow on your way!
That TED talk is very relatable... "Any child who has to keep their guard up all the time and doesn't feel safe, can't dream". That was heartbreaking for me. But also some kind of breakthrough. I'm glad you've also found some messages there that speak to you. I'm not usually convinced to motivational speakers, but sometimes it's worth listening to some people. (If you want to check out, Lisa Nichols was recommended to me, this lady is so positive, I love that. But of course, different things speak to different people.You might be interested more in fixing your career ways, I'm interested in fixing myself as a depression sufferer, for instance.)
I'm so glad you continue to remain active, against all odds, I honestly look up to you. I often can't make myself get out of bed, or even read a paragraph.
Social anxiety is a killer, and I hope you'll be able to find a professional who is willing to assist you. I can tell that you're somewhat resistant, strong and positive, after all. And with all those virtues, you're soon likely to gain all the needed things to get professional help (be it money, courage, time or information).
It's all hard to do it alone. And it's a struggle. But as you've already opened up, it will be better. Please reach out to whomever you think you need.
And please don't take too much on your shoulders. It's wonderful that you can see that you're in charge. You are. But don't let yourself suffer, at least for too long. Take it as a kind piece of advice from a person who's been at the emotional bottom for so long. Too long.
I wish you a great day, too and getting out of this situation. And keep up the good work you do! :)
@greenEyes2019
You're not alone with this. I too have days where I sleep a lot, stay in bed, and hardly do anything, or where I just sit in front of my PC, know what I would have to do, but don't do it.
The reason why I wanna fix this career thing is that it's a huge huge trigger for my self-esteem issues, and it's not getting better. It seems like a key factor. When I did not have this problem yet (during studies) I already worked on depression and other issues, but I feel stuck with it as long as I don't also proceed in other areas - which is this career thing. Because almost everything I wanna do fails on money.
I wanna take a kickboxing course, go climbing, riding, to a restaurant, travel, get a pet, a better apartment and so on, but I can't afford a single thing, and it's especially painful when you know you're as good as everyone else but they have found ways to get paid for what they are good at but I don't. I am basically worthless.
Not as human of course, but in this economy.
Are you in therapy right now?
@greenEyes2019
Thanks for the recommendation with Lisa Nichols, I'll watch a few of her vids.
@ITeleportBread
Aw man, I know what just sleeping and sitting in front of my computer is...
I understand the self-esteem issues. But as you give the impression of being a very conscious and strong person, I can feel you'll figure out your own ways soon. For the time being, I'd still advise you to seek professional help anywhere you can.(helplines perhaps? If not, maybe your dad could be supportive, at least to cover some healt care for you?) I can tell from my own experience: don't let bad things grow and consume you.
It's wonderful that you have all those hobbies and exciting things in mind! I can relate to the money problems as well, but there surely is something awaiting you, career-wise. Money is important, in a way, of course (you have to live somewhere, eat, pay the bills and remain healthy, right?), but rarely do large sums just appear in one's account, don't they? (Not in the majority of cases, unfortunately.) But I'm certain everything will go well for you soon.
Don't say you're worthless, human- or economy-wise. In your last post, you've just proved you can think forward, you want to remain active and that you want to develop. You've probably got lots of others advantages. Doesn't that count? Don't these features make you a good prospective employee who could be paid decent money for their soft skills? I think it is related to economy as well and thus, doesn't make you worthless, in any way whatsoever.
As for me, I've only just started seeing a psychologist, so futher diagnoses and and the most suitable form of therapy is still unknown to me. But so far so good.
Best of luck!
