Are You Dealing With A Covert Narcissistic Passive Aggressive Wife?
I've come to realize after 40+ years of marriage, that the root of our marital issues is her covert narcissistic passive aggressive behavioral attitude. I had always put the blame on myself a lot for some of it, and even beat myself up over it both emotionally and mentally. It's been a long hard struggle a lot of times dealing with this in her. After becoming more aware and educated in it recently, I really see it in her now. She may not be a full fledged covert narcissist, but she has many of the traits for sure. The main issues with her is she has a lot of pride, she's somewhat self righteous, self centered, has very little empathy, and she's quite passive aggressive in her attitude with me.
At the beginning of our marriage and dating, I was too ignorant and stupid to realize what I was getting into. The signs were there, but I wasn't smart enough to see it then. Physically, I was attracted to her back then, and thought that in time, the marriage would get better and improve. Then after two kids, things were still challenging and over the years I just stuck it out because of moral reasons. I was always taught that divorce was not an option. However, I considered divorce after the kids were gone. But I didn't go through with it. I've always been a person of commitment, so it was a hard decision. Now it's even harder being so embedded in this so called life with her.
Right now, because of her behavior, I'm miserable and deal with depression a lot. Some of that depression has to do with being this late in life and change is hard. Family relationships, friendships and the financial situation make it hard to consider separation, but then again, I don't want to be miserable the rest of my life. Hope in her changing... well, there's very little hope in that. Narcissists don't change.... so I've heard anyway.
I hadn't shared anything here in a while, and thought I would come and "unload my brain" on this and maybe some could offer some helpful advice. And maybe I could do the same in this thread. I'm not kidding when I say I'm miserable. Maybe you are too? Feel free to share what you like. Supporting one another does help... 😊
@Spearman60 What are your thoughts about contacting a therapist for helping you plot a course for change - either by working through the relationship issues or by figuring out a new life for yourself?
@PineTreeTree
Thought about it. But I don't have insurance nor would it fit in my budget to pay for that. I'm not optimistic she'll change even with therapy. All the credible ones I've listened to in their podcasts have said narcissist will likely never change. It's embedded behavior that makes them who they are unfortunately... 😊
@Spearman60 I'm always here if you wanna listen to ear
@Spearman60: There’s free therapy. 7 Cups also has therapists and listeners for you to chat with and if you’re not on the Premium version of the site then I’m guessing those features are free.
@akunknown
Missed your reply. Didn't see it till now. This site is a challenge to navigate in. I wasn't aware there might be free therapy here?
@Spearman60
Yeah I totally understand the site navigation challenge bc I’m goin through it too.
Don’t worry about missing replies. Happens to me and to everyone else too.
I’m not sure if the therapy here is free or not. When I mentioned free therapy I was referring to therapy outside of 7 Cups bc I know there is free therapy. It’s just a matter of having the patience to search till you find one that’s a good fit for you. I apologize for not specifying in my earlier comment about not knowing if 7 Cups therapy is free or not.
@akunknown
It's okay. It's been suggested to me to seek out a good therapist but I just can't afford it. I found someone who gave out one free introductory session via Zoom, so I signed up for it. She was friendly and all, but then offered to take me on as a client, but told me it would be something like $300 a month and I believe it was one session. I just couldn't fit that in my budget. I thought it was a bit high. I thought many charge about $100 an hour. It would be nice to have someone professional to talk with about my so called marriage, but it is what it is.... 😊
@Spearman60 I have heard somewhere that if a narcissist changes then he is not actually a narcissist but if he doesn't change by anything then he is a narcissist.
Actually, I'm living with a narcissistic mom and as a kid, I used to idealize her, I thought that this was the best way to live and treat others so I started to treat my friends and fellows as a narcissist. But Now Alhamdulillah I came out of this with the help of my sister's therapy.
so what I mean is ask her if she wants therapy or talk to you openly about why she is like that. Maybe she has been with a narcissist in her childhood so she adopted it. Tell her clearly that I don't want to live with you anymore unless you heal yourself. If she is wise then she will heal and if she is a true narcissist then she will avoid and deny.
I hope you understand :)
@affectionateThinker1218
Problem is, she has a hard time accepting when she's wrong or at fault, which makes it hard to come to any resolution. I'm the type of person that will own up to what I've done wrong. She is not that way. Seldom ever get an apology from her. They say that you can't hardly confront a narcissist because they are hard to get through to. My mother is an overt narcissist. My wife is more of a covert narcissist. It's such an embedded behavior that most therapists will tell you they will never change.
I can see some of her traits in her parents, so she grew up in that atmosphere as a child. I see now what drew me to her many years ago... she has a lot of my mother's traits, so I was drawn to what was familiar... regrettably... 🙁
@Spearman60
Hello my friend ... there are many of us in that boat..... i wonder why so many seem to lose whatever was there when we got together. i feel it is not full fledged narcissism... but in my case I just started wanting somethings to go MY way instead of always his.
We just had an argument and i told him how he never sees anything but his way and then disregards or leaves me out..... he seemed stunned but knows it is right...... we should split but between finances and a life we built we would need to tear down to even walk away whole. It is a miserable exsistence i once referred to as roommates but in reality it is like we share a prison cell.
@toughTiger6481
As you know, I'm in that same boat you are. We've got a nice home I built myself and for us to split, it would rip all that apart and I'd lose so much I worked so hard to get. And I understand about the prison cell... I'm there too. I fantasize a way out and being alone, but it's just too hard. I feel I'd have to start all over again and I'm too old for that. However, I shutter the thought of dealing with this the rest of my life. I don't know what to do... 😔
@Spearman60
It is hard and yet if you find things for yourself and then deal with spouse a bit at a time it is never a one and done conversation.
I just told spouse how i feel yet again and i choose to take care of myself first above any fake couples thing. i think he is seeing it is not a mood or something i will get over... and has been working hard trying to appease me but told him NO that is not how things should go ..... make yourself happy and we can try to be friends... but marriage is over and he killed it.
@toughTiger6481
Our situation has been ongoing for many years and there is nothing that I know of that can change it. She is who she is that's all there is to it and I just have to deal with it. I'm not getting needs met and it's so frustrating. I deal with depression a lot now and then some days are worse than others. It's really a challenge trying to take care of myself and to be happy. I have plenty of work to do and I'm doing okay financially. I just struggle a lot and sometimes it's hard to just to come back here and even talk about it. I wished I had a close friend that I could confide in and talk to around here. This day and age everybody's too busy and self-centered and they are usually just thinking about themselves. I'm slowly trying to learn not to be so codependent on others. But that's hard because it's against my nature. I need friends I need relationships. And I can't seem to get the one I need in my home. And that is so frustrating to me.
So how are you been doing lately? 😊
@Spearman60
Much the same as you ... it is NOT hard to be friends and talk and do things with the person who should know you better then anyone else....
i joined another forum that deals with this issue specifically and even though i thought it would help has only made me angry at the life i am missing by having such a selfish and narcissistic spouse.
i keep myself occupied started a new job that i can build up more financial independence should i choose to leave. Most of the time i ignore him and he only "pretends" all is good around others.... so i tell him "why i already told them we are roommates nothing more you look like a fool trying to put your arm around me or kiss my cheek. "
he began to spiral and wants to " work on it" but told him "great too bad i no longer care enough to ....too little too late" I no longer want him to be present if he is doing it to fool neighbors or grown kids.
@toughTiger6481
Sorry... as I probably said before, I know exactly what you're dealing with. She's the same mostly. I've come to understand I'm dealing with a covert narcissist. She's passive agressive, no empathy, and wants to just ignore the lack of closeness and no interest in intimacy. It's like being married to a lifeless robot. But oh, she has all kinds of caring and love and "coochie coos" for our dog we have in the house... which is a family dog, but my dog mostly. (She goes to work with me all the time) She uses that higher pitch lovey dovey voice only to try to annoy me I guess.
She keeps up with all the good housewife routines she has, but mostly ignores me. I don't get it...
Her problem is she expects me to be the one to breath life into our marriage. I stopped doing all the work and stopped caring anymore. Sadly, she's just not interested in doing her part. I'm just done playing the game. So tired of it.
@Spearman60
I totally get that mine won't even give me time of day UNLESS someone is watching.... then it is fake.
it has gotten worse ............. everything HAS to be his idea .... i have made a dish for him numerous times and yet he brags he just found a new recipe pretends he has NEVER had it..... ....lol ........so i pretend everything in the universe is his idea.... just to shut him up. i am doing more and more alone on my own and treat him more and more like a roommate i am stuck with.
sometimes he acts like he listens but his sorry and try to change can be measured in minutes.
@toughTiger6481
I feel so stuck and trapped, and I know you do too. If nothing changes in the coming months, I may just take the financial losses and exit out of this. I'm not living the rest of my life like this. I'm tired of it. Recently I took the camper, all my tools and my dog and was gone to another state to work on a house for 2 weeks. It was great. I missed my home, but not the one who lives in it. I felt free for a while. Came home and dealt with depression for a while. I just don't want to be around her anymore.
I wished I had a local friend to spend time with. Part of my problem is I don't have any local friends to hang with. Everyone around here is too busy.
@Spearman60
I know exactly what you mean .... so many appear to be busy......... but i say reach out anyway and try .... find a local hobby / club and meet people .....
I am also ready to take the financial hit..... i try so hard to be civil .........yet he only has to do one or two things and i am furious and not wanting to even look at him..... he is oblivious ...
HOW ....HOW can they not see how miserable we are???????? .......... i don't hide it in any way shape or form....... yet he acts shocked if i tell him i am miserable. he has NO clue why ..... "why cant we work on it ?" ..... like amnesia took over.
It is crazy to me..... we cannot keep starting at zero ..... asked him to do things and he says "yep" and continues to play video games..... so i do it myself ................and Bam he has to take over.....what is the purpose of this game ?
@toughTiger6481
You're right. I should try to do that. I have my model trains, and woodcrafts and 3D printing I try to occupy myself with.
She's clueless too. Doesn't even do a thing about our marriage... her covert narcissistic passive aggressive self makes it impossible.
Do you think you're also dealing with narcissistic nature with him? I'm learning more and more about narcissism and realizing she processes much of that behavior in her. Passive aggressiveness, lack of empathy, self centered, etc.
Narcissistic people are very difficult to deal with... it's misery for those who have to deal with it in a spouse.
You're in a rough spot, definitely. If you try for divorce, it's dollars to dimes she will lawyer up & grab as much of your joint assets as she can...maybe even garnish your wages, if she & her lawyer think they can get away with it. Suing for "emotional damages" or some such 🐂💩. I don't know what else to tell you, man.
Hey @Spearman60, I've had experience with narcissistic people as well and would love to chat with you about it but other then this thread, is there away to send personal messages to eachother?
@just1man
Not as members we can't unfortunately.
Were you married to a covert narcissist?
I've dated 3 women, one for 5 years, that rank high on the narc. scale and my mother does as well, unfortunately. I'm currently processing a situation with my last relationship where there was also issues with mental health and substance abuse. Doing a lot of processing and it would be nice to talk with another person with similar stuff.
@Spearman60
a narcissist will ruin everything. I hope you find way to get rid of them. Even in virtual world, a narcissist keeps running things that others built.
Some of a narcissist traits are:
- Grandiose sense of self-importance. ...
- Sense of entitlement. ...
- Exploits others without guilt or shame. ...
- Frequently demeans, intimidates, bullies, or belittles others. Oftentimes in a subtle way.
Some ways to get rid of a narcissist
https://www.wikihow.com/Get-Rid-of-a-Narcissist
@CoolMeCool
She's a covert narcissist. She's very passive aggressive, does little to make the marriage better... meaning puts little to no effort in it. She has very little empathy at all, and lives in her own world independently. As a rest, I deal with loneliness and depression because I don't feel I have a life partner. It's been like that for years. To leave her and even divorce her would be a great financial sacrifice on my part. It's not an easy route to take, but not sure if I will be able to take this much longer. It's very wearisome to say the least.
I hear you!
I just left a similar relationship of 23 years. I am 61 years old. That is when I started to use 7cups . I would suggest reading or listening to the audio (which I have been doing) of “Who Moved My Cheese “ by Spencer Johnson. It’s a simple, but powerful short story about change. Wishing strength to you!
@debramalonern
That's brave of you. I left my Husband of 23 years in 2020 at age 49 thinking there must be more to life than living like this. I didn't do well on my own & had a nervous breakdown but in the meantime destroyed our finances. We reconciled in 2023 & I greatly regret my decisions. That's why I'm on here. I think it takes alot of strength to change your life. Good luck.
I want to say something here, but not sure what to say....
Her behavior just boggles my mind sometimes. I just don't understand it. She puts a lot of energy into other things, like her work, house, her garden, etc., but not in our marriage really. It's like she's always leaving it up to me to maintain it and make things happen. She even admitted to me once that she figures if I "wanted it" I'd come around to it. What??? Does she not once in a while want it to???
Like I said, her behavior is just mind boggling to me. For instance, she's passive aggressive, she has very little empathy at all, she gives my dog (yes, she's basically my dog) all kinds of attention and affection, and she tries to portray the happy wife routine amongst other strange traits and behaviors.
And as far as her idle time, she spends it reading books, messing with her phone, and acts like she is just not interested in doing anything with me. Why?... because it's always up to me. I have to initiate EVERYTHING! Why? Why? Why????? I'm so tired of this! This isn't marriage! It's more like prison if you ask me!
This is the kind of thing that affairs are made of. And you know, she would like more than anything for me to be the one at fault. For me to be the guilty one. For me to be the bad guy. Is this not covert narcissism or isn't it?
I'm one of the easiest persons in the world to get along with.... I really am. I'm somewhat co-dependent, I'll admit that, but I'm working on that. I have a lot of empathy for others. But this one sided lopsided marriage is draining me down to nothing. I want out of this so bad, but circumstances are just so hard, because there will be a lot of ripping and tearing and financial sacrifices as well as other negative repercussions. I wished there was an easy way out, but there isn't.
Sorry.... just had to come here and unload my brain yet again. I'll admit... this gets to be so much and just want to go out and have an affair, but that will compound it even worse. *SIGH*
@Spearman60
It sucks and when NOTHING gets through to them the thoughts of getting companionship and intimacy elsewhere is more tempting all the time.
I think as you said it would be a situation that when they find out they act as if all issues were on you. i guess you could pretend something is going on ... to see how far you could drive her crazy lol
@toughTiger6481
Yeah... classic narcissist trait. They are never wrong, and they always view they other that you're the one with the problem. That's how they think. Not sure if you're familiar with that Life360 app but her and I have it on our phones where we can see where each one is at in location. I thought about just going off and parking at some random house and just sit there for an hour or so and make her wonder if something is going on... LOL 😂
@Spearman60 Do it. Just for s**ts & giggles.
At this point you should realize that either the marriage will endure or you'll find some kind of solace, but not both at the same time. If divorce means financial sacrifice (as it almost always does for the husband), well...what's more important to you? Your assets, or your peace of mind?
@Spearman60 It only took reading your first post to recognize the narcissistic abuse you face. I am the mother of a son that has just left his 10 year marriage for this same situation. My husband and I never knew saw any signs of this abuse. It was all passive aggressive and covert. But he was almost destroyed in that relationship. He so wishes that she had hit him or cheated on him so he had some "proof" of how damaging she was. But she is a master of her manipulation and he is the caring team player that narcissists love to marry. The stories are all so similar. Even if you choose to stay in your marriage, you need to educate your friends about this type of abuse and then have them help you believe it. It is a long journey to find yourself and believe in yourself again - but it is a journey your need to take.
@Spearman60 I can understand how we overlook these warning signs. If everybody was born knowing how to identify their personal flaws and those of others, I would like to think that this world would be a kinder gentler place. But unfortunately, we are too often just a product of our environment. And I am not a psychologist but I would assume your wife has some childhood issues not necessarily trauma but maybe some kind of emotional neglect that makes her feel as though she has to prove something to someone and eventually that has manifested into the type of wife and mother she is.
I am 40 years old, and I'm just now realizing my mother has been an extremely toxic contributor to my life. Never fully comprehending her desire for competition and revenge would strike a physical emotional and mental war, between the two of us and of course any master manipulator, a Grandiose narcissist. For years, things would happen and she would be in the front row, and because my father was her enabler, holding her accountable was just something that wasn't done! As I got older I began to also dismiss her shortcomings, and ignore her aggressive behavior. The gaslighting and manipulation. I covered for her as I faced a 20-year prison sentence. Ironic I was facing numerous felony charges for a drug she introduced me to at the young age of 13. And at 29 when I sat in front of the judge and she sat in the audience, it began to sink in. Had she not introduced me to it, and then once she returned to my life, she again reintroduced me to it, I probably wouldn't be sitting in shackles, and she wouldn't be playing mother to my children. I never got into trouble unless she was in my life. As I neared 40, the vivid picture of just exactly who my "mother" was was beginning to resonate. After forgiving her and trying to move forward for the third time she again came back and the first thing she did was try to get me high, once I declined, that infuriated her!! I also asked that she respect a few rules around my home, my children had routines and some other basic routines mothers and fathers would have. I didn't think I had asked too much, matter of fact I didn't think about it after that.
She sure did. What I asked started a 4-year long stalking and harassment issue, along with some pretty violent and traumatic events. I asked that my son sleep in his own bed, she was living with me at the time. I didn't know that request would trigger her undying desire to seek revenge. She has eventually manipulated the courts and my family, turning all against me, even my young children, ages 6, 10 and 16. After losing everyone I considered close, finding 7 cups has given me a feeling as though a bit of weight has been lifted. And since nobody knows my mother I don't have to defend my sanity and her narcissism. I can just talk about the feelings and thoughts that keep me awake. I find it more soothing to read what others are struggling with, not to take joy in their sadness, but for a moment, I forget all about mine and try to make someone else's thoughts quiet even for just a moment. Thank you for letting me share. I do hope the best for you your wife and your children. Divorce is never easy, but sadness isn't either. The intergenerational cycle of trauma hides well. I am thankful for all involved in 7 cups.
@raspberryHickory198
Thanks for replying. I appreciate you sharing all that. I'm really sorry what all you've been through that's a lot. My mother was an overt narcissist and still is today. So I grew up in that atmosphere. But sounds like you had a lot worse than I did. Seven Cups has helped me some too I managed to make a good friend here who we kind of keep in touch with each other. I hope your life gets better from here on. We all deserve the happiness that we all seek.... 😊
@Spearman60 Hmm... I cannot believe how many people are dealing with this. I just signed up on this site today. It's been almost five years since I've been dealing with a narcissistic, cheating wife whom I had left at one point about two years ago. However, as someone who grew up in Africa, where we were taught to always have the highest level of forgiveness and compassion, I went back to her when she became seriously ill—almost to the point of death. The doctors weren't sure what illness she had, and for the love of my kids, I returned and took care of her. I also noticed she wasn't a caring mother, preferring to be on her phone—either on social media or talking to whomever for at least 90% of her day—letting the kids fend for themselves instead of supervising or helping them while I was at work. When I approached her, she blamed me for everything and never takes responsibility for her actions. The least she would say is, 'I'm not perfect because no woman is perfect.'
@forcefulCat3705
I understand what you're saying I'm not Sheriff divorce is going to be in result here or not. We have a house too and everything is going to get divided up and I just hate to have to make that sacrifice. But I can't live like this for the rest of my life something's got to change and I don't know what changes are going to be necessary. Yes there's a lot of people dealing with this. I'm sorry what you're going through. I hope you can get things worked out as I try to do the same.... 😊
