Why do some forum posts automatically get minimized?

I just re-read this and thought the post may have been unclear, so just to clarify, this is what I'm talking about:

And this sometimes happens automatically without me clicking somewhere to hide/minimise the post. And I am sure I don't accidentally click somewhere to minimize it or something.

@exuberantBlackberry9105

Hey! I think it is a bug because I have noticed it too! 

I am going to tag in some people who might have answers or know people who might. @Tommy @Heather225

@HopieRemi I too have been thinking this might be a bug, though I'm not totally sure. Thank you so much, Remi, for tagging the people who can hopefully give us some answers. 💙

@exuberantBlackberry9105 Tagging @Cheery Mango Can you look into this. Please read the above post, for more information. Could you please try your best to help this member out. Thanks.

@calmMango9611 Thank you for tagging someone who could have answers. I think the tag was meant to be for @CherryMango though?

@exuberantBlackberry9105

The tag is @CheeryMango :D  Team work, dream work!

@HopieRemi Yes it does.

@exuberantBlackberry9105 Yes.

@HopieRemi

@exuberantBlackberry9105

Not to worry, it isn't a glitch! There's an algorithm that decides whether to expand or collapse forum replies, but you can simply hit the arrow and manually expand them.

@Heather225

What is the algorithm based on if I may ask?

@Heather225 Thanks for letting us know. I have the same question on my mind as Remi asked, what is the algorithm based on? And of course, we can manually expand such collapsed replies, but what's the purpose behind collapsing them in the the first place?

@exuberantBlackberry9105 interesting, I've also noticed that! to me it seems like a tw / filtering thing where it collapses posts it views as more negative or something? though its pretty random, not sure XD :)

@tearstruck That's a very interesting observation. I think I might have noticed a bit of that pattern of it collapsing certain types of posts. But I feel like sometimes it's totally random though, so I'm not sure either.

@exuberantBlackberry9105 It's probably done by some AI classifier. Those aren't know to be the best judges of human expression. Just a way to save people from having to respond to others who feel bad.

@cloudySummer Totally agree. AI often doesn't understand things correctly. And I think posts getting collapsed prevents people from seeing them and maybe helping out.

The algorithm is part of a new initiative aimed at highlighting the most helpful and supportive posts in our community. It considers factors such as engagement, content quality, and relevance. The goal is to ensure that valuable and supportive content gets the visibility it deserves.

@CheeryMango Yeah, hiding the negative in a mental health community will help tons, I'm sure.

To clarify what I mean: auto-collapsing people's posts does not contribute to them feeling heard or seen.

@CheeryMango

But the algorithm has collapsed some of my messages offering support :O Maybe it could be introduced to have the collapsing disabled in settings? :) 

@HopieRemi

Biiiiiigg Yes to this! Having that option would be really helpful.

@CheeryMango Thank you for clarifying this. I think it is a nice idea.

@CheeryMango

Many thanks for your response! 

*high fives* 😊 and *hugs* ❤️

@CheeryMango @Heather225 @Jon7Cups

Thanks for explaining what's happening.

Yesterday, I noticed one of my own posts that I spent a lot of effort working on and wording carefully was minimized shortly after I posted it.
https://www.7cups.com/forum/autism/General_2554/Aspergers_333972/

I assumed that someone had read it, found it harmful or offensive, and flagged/reported it, which led to it being minimized. It's not a perfect post, but I felt a bit confused and hurt at the time because I didn't understand what I did wrong.

I put a lot of effort into trying to be accurate while balancing multiple perspectives on a pretty contentious topic. I shrugged it off in the end and told myself, "if my post gets deleted, at least I'll hopefully get an explanation of what I did wrong so I can do a better job of avoiding it in the future".

Today though, I saw a really beautiful post by @DreamsofAuratus that got hidden, and that was when I thought "okay, I didn't do anything wrong then--there must be some kind of site-wide bug, because unlike my post this one is perfect and I can't imagine anybody flagging it".
https://www.7cups.com/forum/personalitydisorders/General_2436/IthinkIshouldgettestedforbpd_335388/

***

I feel that the algorithmic minimizing is catching too many false positives and that the site would be improved by removing it.

I can understand how it would help fill in gaps in human moderation (i.e. catch egregious posts immediately rather than having something really toxic/hurtful sitting out in the open for days before someone spots it and flags it and a human forum moderator gets around to reviewing it).

But it seems like currently the algorithm is using some kind of sentiment analysis that's catching high-quality posts in the cross-fire. Empathetic responses will sometimes mirror negative feelings expressed by the original poster, and that's something that is helpful and should be encouraged.

It's not a big problem, but I personally had a negative experience with the algorithm that I found confusing/distressing, and it looks like I'm not the only person to have had this experience.

Maybe an alternative could be to use the algorithm to set some kind of behind-the-scenes flag/report for posts that need a human review by the forum moderation team?

@QuietMagic

Not in my wildest dreams would I ever think of you, the one who *always* is mindful of what they say and articulates things in the perfect most manner, with the thoughtful most reflection and careful most consideration to say something that wouldn't be good-to-be-seen by the community hehe. So yes, it wasn't you, Josh. :0

I feel there's still less clarity on "what" exactly it is. I've seen different posts collapse and then some don't, a lot of times just emojis or gifs are fine, other times they are minimised, support seeking posts that may have a few potential triggers appear fine but so many times support-giving replies that are genuinely all-good are minimised. 

So the confusion is definitely there and shared by everyone who has either personally experienced the collapsing post, or has been observant enough to see it happening around. 

On a similar note, I'd personally quite like to see the reply limit thingy be removed too.

Such I feel often contributes to the confusion in busy-threads, and see no good reason now for that to exist, when people can literally still comment what they want, but they now need to make some extra clicks, and do it. Purpose? Unclear. (': 

I'd vote for this collapsing thing to be removed too, but just in case, some may find some value in it still, I agree with you and @Hopieremi 's suggestions about installing better/ more relevant filters to assist the algorithm and/or at least, having personal settings to toggle around as per our preference. 

@Sunisshiningandsoareyou

Agreed! 😊 ❤️

@QuietMagic

Hi Magic! 😊 ❤️   

In an effort to help you as well as us all to make sense of why your specific message got collapsed, I did "peek" at it last night. 😊

Me thinks you said nothing wrong, at all. Nothing that the algorithms could have seen in a negative light. However, the OP may have said a few things that the algorithms could have found questionable, but it doesn't collapse an original post. 

Seeing as how you "repeated back" as to what was said by the OP (*high fives* 😊 and extra points for exhibiting your stellar trained active listening skills) I'm thinking this is why the algorithm "drilled down" on your response. 

Hey, guess what? You rock! ❤️ I am grateful for you personally as well as grateful for all that you do here for us here on the platform. Thank you for all that you do to care for everyone! I can understand that being a questionable moment....the "what was it that I did wrong"? Those are hard moments when we are kind and good to others and something just doesn't quite make sense. 

Today we make lemonade out of lemons and get to all appreciate you and your kindness towards others. You keep going strong my friend! You got this! ❤️

*high fives* 😊 and big *hugs*❤️

@QuietMagic If anything, as it is currently being used it makes moderating more difficult. As far as I know we all experience the same minimizing. When I'm going through a thread that seems like it could be problematic, it means extra clicks to see all the posts.

@AffyAvo

Agreed that on a moderating standpoint it is more challenging. If minimize has to stay, I vote that collapsed messages should show up in the flag system and we can unflag it to uncollapse it.

@Heather225 I've noticed, and I think this is taking cups into the wrong direction. You want to help people who feel negative, not hide their words and make them feel ignored and intentionally hidden when they feel bad and express it.

Oh, and by the way, introducing this without any explanation, just 'sneaking it it' is even worse.

@cloudySummer  I agree!  I had wondered about it and now it makes sense

Tagging @jon@7 cups

I think you mean @Jon7cups ?

@HopieRemi

Thanks!

I think I have found another potential reason for the collapsing. It hides anything that is critical in any way, so it improves how cups is seen by search machines. SEO, lol.

The fact that they are not replying to us here in the thread despite all the tags seems to say 'we do not care about our community's concerns, outward appearances are what counts'.

I meant 'not replying to the concerns' - of course they did 'reply' telling us how great the new thing is, ignoring all the evidence for the opposite and the affected persons' concerns about it.

Everytime I see another collapsed message on the forums from some desparate and 'negative' person, I feel sorry for them, because it makes it less likely those posts will get a response, and it makes those persons more likely to just swallow their bad feelings, and be fake happy. Or engage in harmful behaviours towards themselves.

Cups is becoming a gaslighting machine through this (saying 'your bad experiences/feelings don't exist for us'). Are they still thinking they're doing 'good'?